2022 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[Darth-Piekus]

There is a reason why rbr didn't care when James key left. "Next Adrian newey". Lol

Can't expect much more foe a team that takes 4 years to build a wind tunnel

What went wrong though? Is James Key overrated? I had very high hopes for him. He was called the Next Big Thing in aerodynamics. Were so many completely wrong?
When will that Wind Tunnel and Simulator be ready?

[taperoo2k]

It's just sad because I know what McLaren was like when it was actually McLaren. Whatever the fu*k this team has become, it is not McLaren.

What do you mean, which McLaren? Bruce McLaren's team, Ron Dennis' Project Four team or this Zak Brown team? Zak Brown's version had showed continual improvement up to 2021, so it's a bit harsh to say they are not McLaren and on the wrong path.

Actually Bruce Mclaren's team and Ron Dennis's Mclaren team did get all the titles. Zak Brown's version hasn't goten any yet but the worst thing is that they went massively backwards and unless there is a problem that by fixing will put them again in the top 3 I have a fear that they will need again years to catch up.

McLaren went backwards under Ron Dennis in the end in part due to the focus on McLaren's road car business. Zak Brown stabilised the team and he's putting in place what's needed to get McLaren back to the sharp end of the grid eventually. They probably haven't got the brake issue solved yet, which means they are probably not able to fully exploit the car's true pace. Give it a few races before proclaiming the sky is falling in at least.

[Darth-Piekus]

McLaren went backwards under Ron Dennis in the end in part due to the focus on McLaren's road car business. Zak Brown stabilised the team and he's putting in place what's needed to get McLaren back to the sharp end of the grid eventually. They probably haven't got the brake issue solved yet, which means they are probably not able to fully exploit the car's true pace. Give it a few races before proclaiming the sky is falling in at least.

That is true. After 2007 the team started to lose key points of their structure. Do you think that fixing the brake issue and supposedly Mercedes fixes whatever engine problems exist are enough to cover up that much of a difference? I am scared to think that we would need another 3 years to cover up this mess.

[1m0bius1]

Literally rhe worst case scenario happened. You have a car with good balance, but is fundamentally slow. If the car was somewhat unstable, they could have tried to aero out a solution. Guess that's why the car wasn't porpoising. Just trash downforce.

James keys Interview post quali was basically all excuses.

Time to accept reality and switch to next season

[1m0bius1]

Excuses from key..

"The car itself, the platform is working well. Mechanically, it's fine. Aerodynamically, it does what it's supposed to do. The drivers aren't finding the extremes we had in past years with different rates of balance and difficulty. So it's a lot more consistent in that respect.

"What we need is more grip, we need more grip, mechanically, we need more grip aerodynamically. And that showed itself less on Barcelona because the nature of the corners there works better with our car than the nature of the corners here."

So basically the car is a piece of ---. This season is done. They didn't design a car aggressive enough and it shows. 1.5 seconds down. This isn't getting any better if the car is performing as it correlates to as it sits in a wind tunnel. It's simply a slow car no matyer how many upgrades you throw at it. You simply don't close that kind of a gap.

Typically upgrades over an entire season lead to about a 1 second gain between the last race and first race. So this season is done.

[Xero]

There is a reason why rbr didn't care when James key left. "Next Adrian newey". Lol

Can't expect much more foe a team that takes 4 years to build a wind tunnel

What went wrong though? Is James Key overrated? I had very high hopes for him. He was called the Next Big Thing in aerodynamics. Were so many completely wrong?
When will that Wind Tunnel and Simulator be ready?

James Key isn't an aerodynamicist though, he's an engineer with an expertise in chassis development. He's nothing like Adrian Newey.

[1m0bius1]

There is a reason why rbr didn't care when James key left. "Next Adrian newey". Lol

Can't expect much more foe a team that takes 4 years to build a wind tunnel

What went wrong though? Is James Key overrated? I had very high hopes for him. He was called the Next Big Thing in aerodynamics. Were so many completely wrong?
When will that Wind Tunnel and Simulator be ready?

James Key isn't an aerodynamicist though, he's an engineer with an expertise in chassis development. He's nothing like Adrian Newey.

Unfortunately.

[Darth-Piekus]

Who is our Chief Aerodynamicist? Why was James Key getting overhyped as the new Andrian Newey if he wasn't an aerodynamicist.

[taperoo2k]

McLaren went backwards under Ron Dennis in the end in part due to the focus on McLaren's road car business. Zak Brown stabilised the team and he's putting in place what's needed to get McLaren back to the sharp end of the grid eventually. They probably haven't got the brake issue solved yet, which means they are probably not able to fully exploit the car's true pace. Give it a few races before proclaiming the sky is falling in at least.

That is true. After 2007 the team started to lose key points of their structure. Do you think that fixing the brake issue and supposedly Mercedes fixes whatever engine problems exist are enough to cover up that much of a difference?

Fix the brake issue, deal with problems that would have popped up in testing and then we'll see where McLaren are in the pecking order. As for the Mercedes PU ? It's difficult to say. It's either that the Mercedes PU is fine, but Red Bull, Ferrari and Renault have made a leap forward over Mercedes. Or the true pace of the Mercedes PU is being masked by Mercedes powered teams not as yet fully understanding their car concepts and extracting the best performance out of them.

Do I expect McLaren to fix their issues and be fighting with Ferrari and Red Bull ? No. Should they be at least top 5 ? Yes. But we shall see. In any case, the regulations are not likely going to change much so even if this year is a bust, McLaren can focus on improving the design for the following seasons.

I've been watching F1 since the early 90's. Given how cars fell to bits, gearboxes tended to turn into shrapnel and engines let go quite often, it makes me not panic when things go wrong for a team in this era of F1.

[1m0bius1]

Who is our Chief Aerodynamicist? Why was James Key getting overhyped as the new Andrian Newey if he wasn't an aerodynamicist.

Doesn't really matter. What matters is we are over a second off..maybe more. With no correlations issues. So basically a garbage car. The season is a write off. They can throw 20 upgrades at this thing. It's not closing that kind of gap. It simply doesn't happen. Never has and never will.

Merc has the greatest potential as they have multiple issues to solve. The bouncing, etc

Key basically said car is fine. But just lacks mechanical and aero grip. Literally the worst case scenario. Good night Irene.

large upgrades once dialled in lead to gains of 2 to 3 tenths. You talking "Spain update" so basically 5 races to develop and implement. The rest of the season comprises of smaller updates that lead to half a tenth to a tenth. Add these all up over a season you get about 1 second.

The car concept was too conservative and I knew it once they revealed it.

[ALO_Power]

This could be the aftermath of testing compromises + merc p.u. Merc is quite far off the pace themselves as well. Also, keep in mind that no Mercedes customer car made it to Q3. Hopefully it will improve.

[Darth-Piekus]

Doesn't really matter. What matters is we are over a second off..maybe more. With no correlations issues. So basically a garbage car. The season is a write off. They can throw 20 upgrades at this thing. It's not closing that kind of gap. It simply doesn't happen. Never has and never will.

Merc has the greatest potential as they have an issues to solve.

Key basically said car is fine. But just lacks mechanical and aero grip. Literally the worst case scenario. Good night Irene.

Didn't James Key also produced last years car? I remember it was a fine car with the restrictions and makes me wonder if it could be better without them. What happened this year? How did James Key fail so much to produce a car that can give mechanical and aero grip?

[Emag]

A lot can go wrong. From an engineer's point of view, if the car is behaving as you expect it, everything is going fine. The problem is, a car that behaves nicely is not always a fast one. This may be what has happened. If they are indeed held back by issues, they should be back on competitive levels by the summer brake at the latest.

If not, then yeah, it's probably a write off year.

[1m0bius1]

Doesn't really matter. What matters is we are over a second off..maybe more. With no correlations issues. So basically a garbage car. The season is a write off. They can throw 20 upgrades at this thing. It's not closing that kind of gap. It simply doesn't happen. Never has and never will.

Merc has the greatest potential as they have an issues to solve.

Key basically said car is fine. But just lacks mechanical and aero grip. Literally the worst case scenario. Good night Irene.

Didn't James Key also produced last years car? I remember it was a fine car with the restrictions and makes me wonder if it could be better without them. What happened this year? How did James Key fail so much to produce a car that can give mechanical and aero grip?

From what I understand pat fry developed a certain aero philosophy that Key didn't fundamentally change. Just improved. So they just went with the flow so to speak to minimise redesign etc. They just continued that development path "with an eye on the new regs". Well the new regulations are here and this is the result. Miles behind with no correlations issues.

[PhillipM]

Prodomou is the aero guy, not Key, he's also the guy that was under Newey. You lot are getting a lot of wires crossed in the frothing.