wesley123 wrote:Why dontt he teams make the DDD's full with? with a second plane over the full lenght
The wishbone needs to be above the step plane from an engineering perspective. It is not practical or useful down that low (in the 50mm between the planes). The loophole is that if the sprung part of the car is allowed to be visible from below. (for example if you can see inside of the top of the car from bolow the car, you need to have one of the two planes hiding it from view... But if you see the wishbone below then that means you can't see what may be above it... So the diffuser area forward of the axle line (or the top of the car or anything else in there) may be "invisible"!kNt wrote:if you have an unsprung part below the step planeholes above it are permitted.
Are there any regulations restricting unsprung parts of the cars to some area?
If not, one could get rid of the step plane alltogether, fit a large wishbone with sideskirts to the reference plane and the rear wheel (or even to the frontwheel ?) and effectively have a lotus double-floor car. It can't have a wingprofile incorporated but that can be dealt with the diffuser.
I mean I always thought since double-floor cars are illegal also suspension parts below the step plane are illegal. But now it appear such unsprung parts are used to hide the holes in the floor that feed the double-deckers.
Timbo,timbo wrote:Thanks!feni_remmen wrote: If this hole is ahead of the axle line, it does really open a Pandora's box. I think the debate is about to extend to "what is an appropriate to be considered as a sprung part of the car?" I answer to the question about venting isn't a major worry as you would still need to hide the unsprung part of the car, unless it is something like the RB5 had on the weekend.
So it may appear as if teams would make a very wide wishbone it is possible to create a wide, forward placed hole to feed upper deck of the diffuser.
I wonder would it really drive designers to create something awkward?
Pandora box... quite may be!
Astro1 wrote:
If the start of their main diffuser is the minimum rearward position at rear wheel line, and the 3rd deck of Toyota's diffuser starts before that, it seems logical the non DD teams may be annoyed.
1. First opening - seems to be part vertical and part horizontal? It looks like they are taking air out from under the floor, using the gap between the outside sidepod floor level and the central lower floor level of the tub, engine area etc. (??)
2. Second opening - again seems to be part vertical and part horizontal?
3. How is this continous!? Seems like a break in the line to me?
4. What's going on with these scultped bits of the floor?
OK, that sounds harder than i'd hoped. I've no idea how to set up an account with an image hosting service.Giblet wrote:You need to set up an account with an image hosting service, and post the links to those images using the Img button above the message editing window
Imageshack is a free limited hosting service. Allows 7 shots for free I think.
Sorry, but i am dumb. The top wishbones and driveshafts would be useless for this situation! Idiot!feni_remmen wrote:Timbo,timbo wrote:Thanks!feni_remmen wrote: If this hole is ahead of the axle line, it does really open a Pandora's box. I think the debate is about to extend to "what is an appropriate to be considered as a sprung part of the car?" I answer to the question about venting isn't a major worry as you would still need to hide the unsprung part of the car, unless it is something like the RB5 had on the weekend.
So it may appear as if teams would make a very wide wishbone it is possible to create a wide, forward placed hole to feed upper deck of the diffuser.
I wonder would it really drive designers to create something awkward?
Pandora box... quite may be!
Wishbones are reasonably regulated. They closed these down about ten years ago when some teams started thinking about full covered triangles with wingshapes... Tyrrell had some corkers back then. Rule 10.3 in the regs relates to this, but there is still some room to move. Plus there are 2 wishbones,plus driveshafts and trackrods, all should be considered "unsprung" and all can be used to hide the car from below...
That is indeed a lovely picture. It shows that the team is using both loopholes in the regulations, namely the discontinuity and lack of transition that is allowed at the rear wheel centerline, which allows for the vertical opening labeled as 3 in the picture, and the loophole which allows a suspension member to form a part of the deck of the diffuser (opening 1).feni_remmen wrote:Astro1 wrote:
If the start of their main diffuser is the minimum rearward position at rear wheel line, and the 3rd deck of Toyota's diffuser starts before that, it seems logical the non DD teams may be annoyed.
1. First opening - seems to be part vertical and part horizontal? It looks like they are taking air out from under the floor, using the gap between the outside sidepod floor level and the central lower floor level of the tub, engine area etc. (??)
2. Second opening - again seems to be part vertical and part horizontal?
3. How is this continous!? Seems like a break in the line to me?
4. What's going on with these scultped bits of the floor?
Astro,
This is a great photo as it shows the rear leg of the lower rear wishbone and the hole it is being used to "create"! The wishbone is the CF part crossing the picture, just above the word RW centreline and the number 1. It crosses from the endplate on the left, all the way to the third diffuser chamber, then then meets the gearbox on the right. The white box extends further forward under that part. I think. I may be missing something, but that is what i see there.