2022 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal, June 17 - 19

[senja]

Same 'flaw' for everyone though isnt it....So the playing field is still level

Considering how they could simply tell everyone to run x mm higher this solution is just an overcomplication and just designed to save face. By making it a consequence of an individual team's issues, this would imply that it is the team who is at fault, whereas the occurence is a consequence of the ruleset itself.

Take for example, tyre life differs from car to car, can that be a ruleset issue? It's upto each team to figure out right setup or mechanical/aerodynamic solutions to handle the tyre life problem. There will be some aspects of any ruleset which produce undesirable outcomes. If some teams are managing it better than others, just like tyre usage, then it's upto other teams to manage bouncing situation as well. Why blame ruleset?

Because he is a fan of crybabies...

[Hammerfist]

I will never trust Mercedes

Everything they do is calculated to get the decision they want

They have been crying about the porpoising for the last few races while having found a fix for it as seen in Spain.

Baku was not porpoising, it was bumps

So now the FIA bring in a TD about porpoising..

We will see what the frontrunners will be this wkd and see how Merc compares via RB and Ferrai once this new TD is enacted

Lol

[codetower]

They take the 4th turbo with leclerc

I saw this. I guess it's the right decision. Better to start around 11th-12th and finish in the top 5 than to risk another DNF. Hopefully the cooler weather will help with any parts overheating. And they likely can run at full output.

[Hammerfist]

Ferrari bounces and is fast while doing so, they will be hit while also building a car that can perform

The FIA havent targeted performance though...They have targeted driver safety. Probably due to the acting last weekend that we seen.

Of course, the outcome of having a bouncing car, will affect the performance, but I believe Sainz was complaining about it too.

Sainz runs a stiffer car than Leclerc, thus more bouncing

Ferrari bounces a lot, as can be seen from every race so far

They will be affected by this TD

I mean they have been among the worst in almost every race so far visibly. Perhaps the posted data is not giving the full scope.

[Alexf1]

Direct link to FIA article:

https://www.fia.com/news/fia-takes-step ... sts-safety

Excerpt:

A Technical Directive has been issued to give guidance to the teams about the measures the FIA intends to take to tackle the problem. These include:

1. Closer scrutiny of the planks and skids, both in terms of their design and the observed wear
2. The definition of a metric, based on the car’s vertical acceleration, that will give a quantitative limit for acceptable level of vertical oscillations. The exact mathematical formula for this metric is still being analysed by the FIA, and the Formula 1 teams have been invited to contribute to this process.

In addition to these short-term measures, the FIA will convene a technical meeting with the Teams in order to define measures that will reduce the propensity of cars to exhibit such phenomena in the medium term.

It's absurd that teams are going to get handicapped based on something that essentially is just a flaw in the ruleset.

Which ruleset flaw? https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... JPZqF.html

[wesley123]

Considering how they could simply tell everyone to run x mm higher this solution is just an overcomplication and just designed to save face. By making it a consequence of an individual team's issues, this would imply that it is the team who is at fault, whereas the occurence is a consequence of the ruleset itself.

Take for example, tyre life differs from car to car, can that be a ruleset issue? It's upto each team to figure out right setup or mechanical/aerodynamic solutions to handle the tyre life problem. There will be some aspects of any ruleset which produce undesirable outcomes. If some teams are managing it better than others, just like tyre usage, then it's upto other teams to manage bouncing situation as well. Why blame ruleset?

Tires are something that you can understand, what occurs here is a physical phenomenon that stems from running the car low. The ruleset with the underbody tunnels requires the car to run very low to work, which means cars will be running on the bumpstops. But thankfully the 18 inch wheels will provide less dampening than the 13 inch wheels, which means that the ruleset pretty much promotes breaking the drivers' backs.

You'd have a point if there is one outlier, but there isn't. It's literally every team on the grid that suffers with porpoising in some way, and from driver's reports they seem to suffer more and more every race weekend.

Which ruleset flaw? https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... JPZqF.html

Didn't Red Bull suffer a DNF directly related to porpoising?

And outside of that, 9 out of 10 got it wrong then, seems a very unlikely scenario.

Its not the ruleset that's the problem though....its the teams that cant come up with a solution to the problems.

Yeah, that sounds like they messed up the rules. If it was limited to one, I'd fully agree with you, but it's the whole grid

[codetower]

It seems that this is exactly what Mercedes did NOT want. It looks to only apply to teams that currently have heavy porpoising, i.e. Mercedes, Ferrari, Aston, etc. Only those teams will need to raise their car if they can't get porpoising under control, causing them to drop farther down the grid. In the end, it will make THEM even slower, no? Teams like RB, Alfa Romeo, or whoever already has it somewhat under control will not have to change anything.

[Juzh]

People think red bull is in the clear, but they are very obviously porpoising similarly to other teams, they just don't hit the ground while doing so. Below is mercedes/RB/ferrari comparison from baku.


I think it's anyone's guess as to who comes out on top from this shitshow, even mercedes could benefit in some way given how gruesome pile of crap this new technical directive is. Expect DSQ, protests and counter-protests after the race.

[Dee]

People think red bull is in the clear, but they are very obviously porpoising similarly to other teams, they just don't hit the ground while doing so. Below is mercedes/RB/ferrari comparison from baku.


I think it's anyone's guess as to who comes out on top from this shitshow, even mercedes could benefit in some way given how gruesome pile of crap this new technical directive is. Expect DSQ, protests and counter-protests after the race.

Hopefully they are in the clear, even though they have porpoising, they don't have the same vertical g force as others, it seems like, hopefully

[carisi2k]

People think red bull is in the clear, but they are very obviously porpoising similarly to other teams, they just don't hit the ground while doing so. Below is mercedes/RB/ferrari comparison from baku.


I think it's anyone's guess as to who comes out on top from this shitshow, even mercedes could benefit in some way given how gruesome pile of crap this new technical directive is. Expect DSQ, protests and counter-protests after the race.

Wait you are joking right. This video clearly shows how bad Ferrari and Mercedes vertical movement is as you can see and hear it. Formula 1 released a video on the short back straight with Vettel, Ocon and Hamilton and the first 2 cars were ok with no noticeable movement. Hamilton on the other hand was bouncing just as bad as on the front straight.

[carisi2k]

It seems that this is exactly what Mercedes did NOT want. It looks to only apply to teams that currently have heavy porpoising, i.e. Mercedes, Ferrari, Aston, etc. Only those teams will need to raise their car if they can't get porpoising under control, causing them to drop farther down the grid. In the end, it will make THEM even slower, no? Teams like RB, Alfa Romeo, or whoever already has it somewhat under control will not have to change anything.

Aston doesn't have the heavy porpoising anymore. So many people are also mistaking the bottoming out because of the bumpy nature of Baku with porpoising. Bottoming out is where a car is hitting a bump causing a movement or strike to the bottom of the floor. Porpoising is the cars aerodynamics stalling causing the up and down movement. In the previous video the Ferrari and Mercedes are clearly porpoising and bottoming out on the bumps making there movement much more violent then the Red Bulls which were only bottoming out on some of the bumps.

[senja]

People think red bull is in the clear, but they are very obviously porpoising similarly to other teams, they just don't hit the ground while doing so. Below is mercedes/RB/ferrari comparison from baku.


I think it's anyone's guess as to who comes out on top from this shitshow, even mercedes could benefit in some way given how gruesome pile of crap this new technical directive is. Expect DSQ, protests and counter-protests after the race.

Wait you are joking right. This video clearly shows how bad Ferrari and Mercedes vertical movement is as you can see and hear it. Formula 1 released a video on the short back straight with Vettel, Ocon and Hamilton and the first 2 cars were ok with no noticeable movement. Hamilton on the other hand was bouncing just as bad as on the front straight.

Exactly. You can hear when they are touching the asfalt. In Red Bull video you can't hear that.

[Big Tea]

I can see the frequency and length of movement being a debatable here. If say RBR have high frequency but small amplitude, how will this be 'reported'? It could even appear on the naughty list as worse than a lower frequency higher amplitude ride. I get the feeling cans of worms are being stacked as we speak.

[DiogoBrand]

Considering how they could simply tell everyone to run x mm higher this solution is just an overcomplication and just designed to save face. By making it a consequence of an individual team's issues, this would imply that it is the team who is at fault, whereas the occurence is a consequence of the ruleset itself.

Take for example, tyre life differs from car to car, can that be a ruleset issue? It's upto each team to figure out right setup or mechanical/aerodynamic solutions to handle the tyre life problem. There will be some aspects of any ruleset which produce undesirable outcomes. If some teams are managing it better than others, just like tyre usage, then it's upto other teams to manage bouncing situation as well. Why blame ruleset?

Tires are something that you can understand, what occurs here is a physical phenomenon that stems from running the car low. The ruleset with the underbody tunnels requires the car to run very low to work, which means cars will be running on the bumpstops. But thankfully the 18 inch wheels will provide less dampening than the 13 inch wheels, which means that the ruleset pretty much promotes breaking the drivers' backs.

You'd have a point if there is one outlier, but there isn't. It's literally every team on the grid that suffers with porpoising in some way, and from driver's reports they seem to suffer more and more every race weekend.

Which ruleset flaw? https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... JPZqF.html

Didn't Red Bull suffer a DNF directly related to porpoising?

And outside of that, 9 out of 10 got it wrong then, seems a very unlikely scenario.

Its not the ruleset that's the problem though....its the teams that cant come up with a solution to the problems.

Yeah, that sounds like they messed up the rules. If it was limited to one, I'd fully agree with you, but it's the whole grid

If every team is suffering equally from porpoising like you say, then every team will need to sacrifice performance to satisfy the new rule.
If not all teams are suffering equally, then the ones who did a better job will have the advantage.
So what are you complaining about?

[Zynerji]

No respect for a directive meant to catch up sub-optimal design decisions of the currently failing teams.

Why make a huge change to cause a shakeup, and then TD the old guard back to the front?