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Raw pace doesn't always win you title... Sainz with the usual "no DNF-mid finish" he do could be closer to Verstappen than Charles without his very very silly mistakes at the beginning of the year.
Ah so Leclerc deficit to Verstappen is related to his mistakes? Are we watching the same races?
Have the feeling you are posting in bad faith at this point.
Remember Imola ? Remember Jeddah where he spent most of the race in the lead.
He bottled it in qualy on Saturday, and then missed his race start and doing questionable move against Perez/Hamilton
In Baku missed his start and get overtook on one of the shortest venue to T1 of the year.
Miami for me is 50-50 he's doing a little mistake in the last corner and Verstappen overtake him but it was probably impossible to resist that day, and after the SC overtaking Verstappen was almost impossible with the top speed disadvantage.
Spain was a masterclass from him, apart from that he's not been clinical enough (like Max since Australia... or Lewis in the 2nd half of 2021) even if he's an animal on raw pace.
Ferrari has a big problem with confidence in the strategy desk.
First you have the confidence of the drivers.
VER and HAM often complain about strategy calls, but when the "Box Box Box" command is given, they trust their engineers and head into the pits. With Ferrari, it seems to be a negotiation every time, and LEC being the more compliant one, too often gets the short end of the stick for it.
This takes time, and makes them miss their windows of opportunity. If the Safety car wouldn't have come out, I'm pretty sure HAM would have came bearing down on both SAI and LEC. A racing driver, especially for Ferrari, needs to be able to cope with a direct instruction "You are not fast enough. Now let your teammate through". Repeated requests to up the pace is just a silly waste of time.
They also need to be able to cope with the fact that sometimes they are sacrificed for the greater good. I guess Abu Dhabi wasn't fun for PER last season, but it's all a part of the gig. Here LEC had both track position and championship position, but SAI was still given the optimum strategy. This was probably because his tires were worse, and he would probably fall like a stone at the restart. But that would have been a part of the job. A team needs to make those calls, and a driver in a top team needs to accept them.
Secondly, the Ferrari strategy desk needs to have some confidence in itself. It seems like RB and Merc plans outs it's races and acts on events, whilst Ferrari mererly reacts to others, which almost always put's them on the back foot.
Both drivers complied with Ferrari’s wishes. Don’t see what you’re getting at here.
Sainz didn't comply with the 10 car-lengths gap request during the SC. And that won him the race. He's overruled the team in Monaco too and he nearly won there too. It's clear what he's getting at there so I'm not sure why you're intentionally acting dense.
Don't understand your point regarding Sainz and the 10 car lenght during SC ?
Raw pace doesn't always win you title... Sainz with the usual "no DNF-mid finish" he do could be closer to Verstappen than Charles without his very very silly mistakes at the beginning of the year.
Ah so Leclerc deficit to Verstappen is related to his mistakes? Are we watching the same races?
Have the feeling you are posting in bad faith at this point.
Remember Imola ? Remember Jeddah where he spent most of the race in the lead.
He bottled it in qualy on Saturday, and then missed his race start and doing questionable move against Perez/Hamilton
In Baku missed his start and get overtook on one of the shortest venue to T1 of the year.
Miami for me is 50-50 he's doing a little mistake in the last corner and Verstappen overtake him but it was probably impossible to resist that day, and after the SC overtaking Verstappen was almost impossible with the top speed disadvantage.
Spain was a masterclass from him, apart from that he's not been clinical enough (like Max since Australia... or Lewis in the 2nd half of 2021) even if he's an animal on raw pace.
Oh so Jeddah was a silly mistake? Ahahahah. Not like an unfortunate VSC with the RB being 30 km/h faster in the straight.
Despite all the bottling you're talking about he was still ahead of Sainz yesterday. That doesn't look that good for the latter.
In Baku he was first and on track to arrive at least 2nd before the DNF.
Imola he made a stupid mistake. The fact that Sainz he is still behind him in the championship highlight how slow he has been.
Ah so Leclerc deficit to Verstappen is related to his mistakes? Are we watching the same races?
Have the feeling you are posting in bad faith at this point.
Remember Imola ? Remember Jeddah where he spent most of the race in the lead.
He bottled it in qualy on Saturday, and then missed his race start and doing questionable move against Perez/Hamilton
In Baku missed his start and get overtook on one of the shortest venue to T1 of the year.
Miami for me is 50-50 he's doing a little mistake in the last corner and Verstappen overtake him but it was probably impossible to resist that day, and after the SC overtaking Verstappen was almost impossible with the top speed disadvantage.
Spain was a masterclass from him, apart from that he's not been clinical enough (like Max since Australia... or Lewis in the 2nd half of 2021) even if he's an animal on raw pace.
Oh so Jeddah was a silly mistake? Ahahahah. Not like an unfortunate VSC with the RB being 30 km/h faster in the straight.
Despite all the bottling you're talking about he was still ahead of Sainz yesterday. That doesn't look that good for the latter.
In Baku he was first and on track to arrive at least 2nd before the DNF.
Imola he made a stupid mistake. The fact that Sainz he is still behind him in the championship highlight how slow he has been.
Yes. I'm not here to defend Sainz.
I just think Ferrari fans should expect more from Charles and not only hide behind the usual clownery from Ferrari.
I still think Max/Lewis, even with these clownery from Ferrari on some occasions would have more points than Charles.
Ferrari has a big problem with confidence in the strategy desk.
First you have the confidence of the drivers.
VER and HAM often complain about strategy calls, but when the "Box Box Box" command is given, they trust their engineers and head into the pits. With Ferrari, it seems to be a negotiation every time, and LEC being the more compliant one, too often gets the short end of the stick for it.
This takes time, and makes them miss their windows of opportunity. If the Safety car wouldn't have come out, I'm pretty sure HAM would have came bearing down on both SAI and LEC. A racing driver, especially for Ferrari, needs to be able to cope with a direct instruction "You are not fast enough. Now let your teammate through". Repeated requests to up the pace is just a silly waste of time.
They also need to be able to cope with the fact that sometimes they are sacrificed for the greater good. I guess Abu Dhabi wasn't fun for PER last season, but it's all a part of the gig. Here LEC had both track position and championship position, but SAI was still given the optimum strategy. This was probably because his tires were worse, and he would probably fall like a stone at the restart. But that would have been a part of the job. A team needs to make those calls, and a driver in a top team needs to accept them.
Secondly, the Ferrari strategy desk needs to have some confidence in itself. It seems like RB and Merc plans outs it's races and acts on events, whilst Ferrari mererly reacts to others, which almost always put's them on the back foot.
Hmmmm..... Hamilton vs Niko in the last race of the season purposely backed Nico into competitors instead of keeping a good pace. Hamilton was not obeying team orders and could potentially have caused a disaster. Too much complaining going on here.
Can anyone really be 100% sure that if Ferrari double stacked their drivers in pit that Perez and Hamilton and others would have pitted. Why wouldn't they just keep track position and let Ferrari come out in a crowd?
Can anyone really be 100% sure that if Ferrari double stacked their drivers in pit that Perez and Hamilton and others would have pitted. Why wouldn't they just keep track position and let Ferrari come out in a crowd?
Ferrari had free pitstop against Perez IIRC. He was like 20+secs behind them. They would only have Hamilton in front. But were probably doubting if they cannot pass HAM in like lap or two that soft would then degrade. I cannot think of other reason
Both drivers complied with Ferrari’s wishes. Don’t see what you’re getting at here.
Sainz didn't comply with the 10 car-lengths gap request during the SC. And that won him the race. He's overruled the team in Monaco too and he nearly won there too. It's clear what he's getting at there so I'm not sure why you're intentionally acting dense.
And if he had stayed in position as you are suggesting an strict driver policy would’ve, would you have been more happy with the result or no?
I'm criticizing Ferrari for proposing something so ridiculous to Sainz. Of course Sainz will never comply to that as he shouldn't. Mind you, part of them not pitting Leclerc hinged on this absurd strategy of Sainz covering for Leclerc at the restart as Binotto's statements hinted post-race. Utterly ludicrous. I know you really want to make the insinuation that I'm fanboying for Leclerc but you can look at my past posts on the team thread and I stood up for Sainz when he was being trashed during his unlucky streak of races. I'm a team guy and this was not a good team result. We should have had a 1-2 or at minimum a 1-3.
Also, yes, even in teams with no clear no. 1 driver, the LEAD driver ALWAYS gets the preferred strategy which Leclerc didn't get. Spin it and look at it however you want, Ferrari (not Sainz who made the best of the opportunity he was given) royally --- up on all fronts (again).
Last edited by Drift4794 on 04 Jul 2022, 16:55, edited 1 time in total.
Was 2 Ferraris on podium still possible even after pitstop mess ?
come to think of it...as we all saw Lerclerc fought brilliantly and held off perez & lewis for long enough on old hards for sainz to pull a secured gap.
so , the question im having is ...was it so difficult for sainz to do this with fresh tyres ? imo even after pitstop mess 2 podiums were still a good possibility. May be perez would have snicked in ...but still
imo parez, sainz, Charles could have finished ( in any order ) finished in top 3.
Gentle reminder that Adami still has his job and is Carlos' race engineer:
What's your point?
Did he do something yesterday that caused you to question his ability?
Yes, telling Carlos to back up the pack lol so Charles could build a gap. Didn't you watch the race? My point is also of a larger culture of complacency at the top level when it comes to the strategy department. After these types of antics in 2020, Adami should've been fired. He wasn't. Inaki Rueda has been the head of strategy since 2014. Why has he not been fired after his ridiculous strategy calls were partly responsible for the failed title challenges in '17 and '18? I'm not gonna even mention 2020 which was a clown show. Ferrari have consistently shown an inability to think on their feet when confronted with unexpected situations. They're too conservative, too reactive unlike RB and Merc whose strategy teams are proactive.
As I type this, the team still won't admit they got the strategy wrong for Leclerc. From AMuS:
Big egos and pride will never win you championships -- ruthless self-examination and humility will, something the team is seemingly still not ready to do.
I'm sitting here on my chair typing away still fuming 2 days later. I can't even imagine what Leclerc is going through. Of course, he's very mentally strong but he's only human. Don't know how long it'll last until he snaps and finally calls out the team in public for bungling his championship.
Gentle reminder that Adami still has his job and is Carlos' race engineer:
What's your point?
Did he do something yesterday that caused you to question his ability?
Yes, telling Carlos to back up the pack lol so Charles could build a gap. Didn't you watch the race? My point is also of a larger culture of complacency at the top level when it comes to the strategy department. After these types of antics in 2020, Adami should've been fired. He wasn't. Inaki Rueda has been the head of strategy since 2014. Why has he not been fired after his ridiculous strategy calls were partly responsible for the failed title challenges in '17 and '18? I'm not gonna even mention 2020 which was a clown show. Ferrari have consistently shown an inability to think on their feet when confronted with unexpected situations. They're too conservative, too reactive unlike RB and Merc whose strategy teams are proactive.
Big egos and pride will never win you championships -- ruthless self-examination and humility will, something the team is seemingly still not ready to do.
That explanation is so much flawed
1. this is not monaco where track position is everything. with somany laps in hand track position vs fresh tyres is the dumbest argument to have.
2. comparison with lewis & abu dhabi - again , there it was only 3 laps remaining here it was a lot more to play for ... nonsense comparison.
3. pitting Leclerc was win for sure...it was going nowhere.
if this is the attitude then... Charles must leave...TOTO should be watching carefully.
Yes, telling Carlos to back up the pack lol so Charles could build a gap. Didn't you watch the race? My point is also of a larger culture of complacency at the top level when it comes to the strategy department. After these types of antics in 2020, Adami should've been fired. He wasn't. Inaki Rueda has been the head of strategy since 2014. Why has he not been fired after his ridiculous strategy calls were partly responsible for the failed title challenges in '17 and '18? I'm not gonna even mention 2020 which was a clown show. Ferrari have consistently shown an inability to think on their feet when confronted with unexpected situations. They're too conservative, too reactive unlike RB and Merc whose strategy teams are proactive.
As I type this, the team still won't admit they got the strategy wrong for Leclerc. From AMuS:
Big egos and pride will never win you championships -- ruthless self-examination and humility will, something the team is seemingly still not ready to do.
I'm sitting here on my chair typing away still fuming 2 days later. I can't even imagine what Leclerc is going through. Of course, he's very mentally strong but he's only human. Don't know how long it'll last until he snaps and finally calls out the team in public for bungling his championship.
You think was an idea Adami just randomly thought of himself? Are you serious right now?
That's not his call. He gets his info from the strategy team and its relayed to the driver. Your anger seems very misplaced and its not making sense. And if you're still fuming after 2 days you should get some help.
Yes, telling Carlos to back up the pack lol so Charles could build a gap. Didn't you watch the race? My point is also of a larger culture of complacency at the top level when it comes to the strategy department. After these types of antics in 2020, Adami should've been fired. He wasn't. Inaki Rueda has been the head of strategy since 2014. Why has he not been fired after his ridiculous strategy calls were partly responsible for the failed title challenges in '17 and '18? I'm not gonna even mention 2020 which was a clown show. Ferrari have consistently shown an inability to think on their feet when confronted with unexpected situations. They're too conservative, too reactive unlike RB and Merc whose strategy teams are proactive.
As I type this, the team still won't admit they got the strategy wrong for Leclerc. From AMuS:
Big egos and pride will never win you championships -- ruthless self-examination and humility will, something the team is seemingly still not ready to do.
I'm sitting here on my chair typing away still fuming 2 days later. I can't even imagine what Leclerc is going through. Of course, he's very mentally strong but he's only human. Don't know how long it'll last until he snaps and finally calls out the team in public for bungling his championship.
You think was an idea Adami just randomly thought of himself? Are you serious right now?
That's not his call. He gets his info from the strategy team and its relayed to the driver. Your anger seems very misplaced and its not making sense. And if you're still fuming after 2 days you should get some help.
You're right. His job is to relay information. Too bad he's terrible at that too as the clip I linked above showed. Seb continuously has to ask for basic info that should be automatically provided to him and has to make him do elementary target lap time calculations. Oh and congrats on ignoring the entire part where I talk about the larger problem with the strategy department.
As usual, your only response has been smug replies and feeble attempts at gotchas, none of which will change the basic conclusion that the team needs a major revamp in the strat department.
