2022 French Grand Prix - Le Castellet, July 22 - 24

[mendis]

why? no contact was made, they reset and george later passed him fairly. would your assessment be the same for max last year in AD for the exact same move and consequence he did on ham at the start?

The AD is just pointless to bring back up.

This scenario is no different to the one of Ocon who got a penalty for the same thing.
You still need to leave space for the car on the outside - regardless of contact or not

I thought it was very valid to bring up AD.

It was wrong in AD and it was wrong in today and it was wrong in 2019 Monaco. Drivers just can't drive in straight line when jammed for space. Having said that, anyone that is jamming should get a penalty if not ahead.

[morefirejules08]

I can't even imagine what he was mumbling about on the radio, he had absolutely no business being there and then left no room, basically created collision situation, should have received something like a warning, not a penalty, but warning from stewards, that was unacceptable move, especially coupled with moaning on the radio, he seems to think he had legit claim to that corner

this is pretty much what max did to ham several times last year such as imola and the race start in AD... divebombs to force the move or take them both out. its funny how some people just forget about the blue driver last year and excuse that as hard racing.

Let’s make everything back into a VER/HAM “issue”. Whoever it is, it isn’t right to dive bomb anyone and have the car now on the outside only with 2 choices. Bailing out or know the impact is going to come. If the car on the inside cannot make the corner then it’s not a move that’s “on”

The problem is you now have people who defended max last season complaining and asking for penalties this season about comparable moves.

[f1jcw]

The AD is just pointless to bring back up.

This scenario is no different to the one of Ocon who got a penalty for the same thing.
You still need to leave space for the car on the outside - regardless of contact or not

I thought it was very valid to bring up AD.

It was wrong in AD and it was wrong in today and it was wrong in 2019 Monaco. Drivers just can't drive in straight line when jammed for space. Having said that, anyone that is jamming should get a penalty if not ahead.

I have no idea what Jamming is.

Many of previous overtakes were of the type let me through or we crash and that was applauded, even by some team bosses.

I think George was over optomistic, but no harm seemed done. as for a pen, pfffff

[101FlyingDutchman]

this is pretty much what max did to ham several times last year such as imola and the race start in AD... divebombs to force the move or take them both out. its funny how some people just forget about the blue driver last year and excuse that as hard racing.

Let’s make everything back into a VER/HAM “issue”. Whoever it is, it isn’t right to dive bomb anyone and have the car now on the outside only with 2 choices. Bailing out or know the impact is going to come. If the car on the inside cannot make the corner then it’s not a move that’s “on”

The problem is you now have people who defended max last season complaining and asking for penalties this season about comparable moves.

No defending from me. BUT what I will say, if the driver on the inside is able to make the corner then it’s a fair overtake for leaving the door open.
My issue and always has been is with the haphazard stewarding/policing of the rules. There is no even handed approach which frustrates us “purists” more than the average F1 watcher who just enjoys the drama of it all

[GrizzleBoy]

Let’s make everything back into a VER/HAM “issue”. Whoever it is, it isn’t right to dive bomb anyone and have the car now on the outside only with 2 choices. Bailing out or know the impact is going to come. If the car on the inside cannot make the corner then it’s not a move that’s “on”

The problem is you now have people who defended max last season complaining and asking for penalties this season about comparable moves.

No defending from me. BUT what I will say, if the driver on the inside is able to make the corner then it’s a fair overtake for leaving the door open.
My issue and always has been is with the haphazard stewarding/policing of the rules. There is no even handed approach which frustrates us “purists” more than the average F1 watcher who just enjoys the drama of it all

Imo it's kinda silly to decide that any kind of terrible and dirty driving that includes pushing other cars off the track is fine as long as the car doing it does not cross too far over the white line.

Otherwise putting cars into the wall in Monaco and Singapore is fine as long as the overtaking car doesn't also crash out.

We should be aiming for drivers to make overtakes on the track while allowing the defending car to also be allowed to space on the track to continue racing.

The racing standards for F1 should be higher than console racing game lobbies, not lower.

[chrisc90]

why? no contact was made, they reset and george later passed him fairly. would your assessment be the same for max last year in AD for the exact same move and consequence he did on ham at the start?

The AD is just pointless to bring back up.

This scenario is no different to the one of Ocon who got a penalty for the same thing.
You still need to leave space for the car on the outside - regardless of contact or not

I thought it was very valid to bring up AD.

Max’s overtake on Lewis on the last lap of AD was perfectly fine, he didn’t dive bomb and run Lewis off the track at all. Had you mentioned Brazil - that would be more fitting

[Mogster]

Russell performed the move he’s talked about recently, all the matters is being ahead at the apex and within the white lines which he was.

Dive bombs are OK according to race control. It’s the same move Max used last year several times and was ruled OK. That was the cause of Russell’s frustration, he was ahead at the apex and stayed within the white lines, so everything was OK? No?

[GrizzleBoy]

The AD is just pointless to bring back up.

This scenario is no different to the one of Ocon who got a penalty for the same thing.
You still need to leave space for the car on the outside - regardless of contact or not

I thought it was very valid to bring up AD.

Max’s overtake on Lewis on the last lap of AD was perfectly fine, he didn’t dive bomb and run Lewis off the track at all. Had you mentioned Brazil - that would be more fitting

Pretty sure it's the first lap attempt that they're talking about where he dive bombed and left Ham with no other choice other than to park and wait for Ves to slowly make the turn, crash, or go off track. .

Nobody had any issue with Maxs last lap overtake.

[organic]

Charles' minisectors before crash

[Sieper]

It is not Ves but Ver.

Lewis went of track there and so did Perez here. Lewis did not give back all the time, and neither did Perez. No investigation on both.

The only problem I have is the amount of politicking. Too much. I feel we would be better of with less of it.

[f1jcw]

The AD is just pointless to bring back up.

This scenario is no different to the one of Ocon who got a penalty for the same thing.
You still need to leave space for the car on the outside - regardless of contact or not

I thought it was very valid to bring up AD.

Max’s overtake on Lewis on the last lap of AD was perfectly fine, he didn’t dive bomb and run Lewis off the track at all. Had you mentioned Brazil - that would be more fitting

I think it was first lap AD that was being refered to where people asked for a Lewis pen for running off track like Perez did today

[Sieper]

https://i.imgur.com/upFJQzr.png

Charles' minisectors before crash

Too fast into the corner. On too used tires. Like at Monza a few years ago.

[Sevach]

https://i.imgur.com/upFJQzr.png

Charles' minisectors before crash

Turned in too hot.

[dialtone]

Good job Max, inching closer to actually keeping the WDC.



* Rough race for Ferrari, wasn't looking too bad at the start, for the first time since Imola Ferrari had a great start, probably thanks to the new clutch.
* Despite what everyone was adamant about on tire degradation from FP2, Ferrari had pretty good tire life, in fact people are even questioning whether Sainz should have pitted at lap 42, with 24 laps old Mediums that would have needed to last till 34 to reach the end, with some visible blistering on the front tires.
* On the other hand Gasly managed to get to the end of the race, albeit he was lapping 2s/lap slower than Sainz.
* Leclerc made a mistake in Turn 10, at crashed out at lap 18 after a tough first part of the race, and being able to open a gap of just about 2 seconds right around lap 16.

Sadly there's no telemetry for lap 18 on LEC so I can't quite show a graph to validate what happened, however Charles admitted to it being his mistake, probably under pressure to push as hard as he could to make up for Verstappen undercut.



* Looking at these lap times it's easy to see that all the tire degradation problems that everyone was talking about on Ferrari didn't actually exist. Ferrari just had the engine tuned down in FP2.
* It easier to see here also that Gasly got to the end with no pits, but was a lot slower than Sainz, so hard to use it as a direct comparison, but clearly someone did get to the end, and perhaps Ferrari could have dared a bit more here, they would have gotten lucky with the VSC if nothing else, plus they had Sainz sit behind Perez for so long, if they wanted to pit anyway they could have done it earlier, but ultimately nothing would have changed in that case. Sainz himself mentioned that he asked the team to let him finish the overtake and then he would have pitted.

Lap 11 was probably the best chance for VER to pass LEC:


* He had a HUGE speed advantage on that lap, 29kph between DRS and tow in the back straight, 32kph at T1, but Ferrari was just stronger in S3 all race (LEC first, SAI later) and was able to keep him far enough that it never mattered.
* And on the straight without DRS into T10 his top speed advantage was just 8kph, not enough to be able to pass, compounded with the need to brake much earlier due to being so close to the car in front that it compromises his downforce.

As soon as LEC got out of DRS range:


* That top speed gap became more reasonable at 11kph with just the tow, and looking at the performance of the car in the corners, those tires were still very alive, compared to the Red Bull.

Sadly Ferrari today was again the better car, but when it's not reliability, it's driver errors or strategy calls although today with the forced pit by the SC everyone pit at the same time.

Checo and Russell had an eventful VSC ending at lap 50:


Russell created a big gap in front of him in the back straight, created enough margin that when the restart came he was able to go quickly, about 27kph faster than Perez who instead was still braking when Russell had the throttle down.

Nothing Perez he could have done there at that point, I think Perez managed his VSC badly.

I think the championship gets really hard now, everything can still happen especially with the TD change in Belgium but as a Ferrari fan I do feel it's probably slipping away.

cheers

[GrizzleBoy]

It is not Ves but Ver.

Lewis went of track there and so did Perez here. Lewis did not give back all the time, and neither did Perez. No investigation on both.

The only problem I have is the amount of politicking. Too much. I feel we would be better of with less of it.

Lewis was judged to have given back the time by the stewards, and the fact that he was forced off track was also in consideration.

No idea whether Sergio gave any time back, but again he left track because he wa left with no other choice so I don't see why he would even need to.