2021 Cost Cap Rumours and Speculation

[mendis]

From what I've heard RedBull will have less than 1
month off to be diluted. We can hypothesize 0.15 "sec of lack of aero development without going too far from reality #F1

Duchessa who is a source very close to Ferrari and its engineers says the 10% less aero time is likely to be worth around 1.5 tenths

They would be unable to compete for poles late next year or in 2024! That's cool.

[dans79]

From what I've heard RedBull will have less than 1
month off to be diluted. We can hypothesize 0.15 "sec of lack of aero development without going too far from reality #F1

Duchessa who is a source very close to Ferrari and its engineers says the 10% less aero time is likely to be worth around 1.5 tenths

They would be unable to compete for poles late next year or in 2024! That's cool.

you also need to keep in mind they get less time to start with because of winning the championship!

[Hoffman900]

This also is so much more complicated than it needs to be.

F1 is just a bunch of people saying / doing things in the most breathlessly complicated way to give the illusion they are smarter than everyone.

Managing engineers, I sometimes have to remind people that saying / and doing things in the simplest way is often better. This is also why engineers are often not allowed to write specifications and contracts.

As someone who holds the title of "Systems Engineer" I take a slight offence to this.

Imo, this is probably the FIA trying to ensure somen can't game the system. For example if they did a mid season rule change, someone who stockliped time might gain and advantage. It's all about the show you know!

I’d argue mid season rule changes shouldn’t be allowed. Even most amateur orgs have rules against that, but I get your point. The frozen engine spec is how Merc got a big jump and held it back in 2014.

[mendis]

Duchessa who is a source very close to Ferrari and its engineers says the 10% less aero time is likely to be worth around 1.5 tenths

They would be unable to compete for poles late next year or in 2024! That's cool.

you also need to keep in mind they get less time to start with because of winning the championship!

Considering TD039 put our Ferrari on the backfoot and Mercedes is going back to 2021 drawing board, do you think it's such a bad situation for Red Bull?

[littlebigcat]

IMO, without a proportionate reduction in their ability to spend, they will just redistribute the cost of the testing to other projects

[dans79]

Mercedes is going back to 2021 drawing board, do you think it's such a bad situation for Red Bull?

I personally wouldn't make that assumption!

[chrisc90]

It really wouldnt surprise me if all these teams are running aero development outside of the allocated allowances. Im sure there will be other close engineers in other businesses who can pick up a USB stick after a party and run some runs through the tunnel/cfd to see if its any good.

[MV8]

So, no surprises, Red Bull cheated and FIA applied a (non)penalty that is what all of us were expecting.

[yamahasho]

IMO, without a proportionate reduction in their ability to spend, they will just redistribute the cost of the testing to other projects

Good one, never thought of it this way, there are many positives for Red Bull, this penalty is hurting others teams but only slightly hurts Red Bull. The teams need to protest.

Honda has there own wind tunnel and one of the best in the world, not sure how resources are shared. It's good to be Honda right now.

[Xwang]

It really wouldnt surprise me if all these teams are running aero development outside of the allocated allowances. Im sure there will be other close engineers in other businesses who can pick up a USB stick after a party and run some runs through the tunnel/cfd to see if its any good.

I agree with you. FIA cannot and doesn't want to police these rules. Immagine how many usb sticks you can put in a can of ....

[Zynerji]

In 2022, a $10k USD, you can build a multi-teraflop desktop CFD computer for your home.

I never understood how these aero engineers are prevented from doing "studies" at home, then bringing that knowledge to the office, and re-create their findings there.

[mendis]

Mercedes is going back to 2021 drawing board, do you think it's such a bad situation for Red Bull?

I personally wouldn't make that assumption!

I am sure you didn't expect them to be so far behind to start this year as well. In fact, I am afraid, it could be a pickled situation for them with some changes to floor and diffuser area for next year.

[DGP123]

Doubtful it’s policed so stringently. Sport is run so badly, Newey’s probably popping down that wind tunnel every day.

Total joke, but that’s the way the sport has headed for some time now. 21-23 tainted

[TimW]

I wonder what the review process will be next year. This year the FIA only review the submissions and did not investigate beyond that(also citing that it is the first year of the cost cap). I'd expect them step up next year and also do some checks if the submitted numbers are correct. But that would mean an even more lengthy process, which is certainly not what you want.

[MV8]

I mean, The FIA were pretty naive just with the creation of "minor breach" penalties, is true that most part of the teams played under this cost cap, but didn't they take in count the fact that a team could play with this to have some advantages? If they create now harsher penalties for this range of overspend they are accepting that they failed, expecting teams to overspend now.