2022 São Paulo Grand Prix - Interlagos, Nov 11 - 13

[cirrusflyer]

But if Max only stays on track by being on the outside kerb within the track limits, where does it leave Lewis to go? He is required to be given space at that point on track. So if he is required to leave the track, the move is still illegal (again).

Well we don't know what would happen because of the collision obviously. I think Max would likely have pushed Hamilton out, given their previous encounters, but he might have made an effort to slow down and leave enough space for Hamilton. We don't know. Hypothetical scenarios can't be the basis for stewards, but they sure made an arbitrary decision that Max basically wasn't entitled to track position being "too fast"

This gives a R50.74 which is still a 9% increase in force from Hamilton's fastest lap. I would still consider this a significant increase in force, especially when you consider that Max's line demanded he run the right side on top of the inside kerb which would have unsettled the car. To make R55 work in this scenario he has to leave the track by 3-4m which would be pretty similar to where he actually ended up after the accident, just past the T3 kerb. That would make me think the collision didn't actually alter his line all that much.

https://i.ibb.co/5kxNS3y/igos2.png

Wow, great effort! Thanks for sharing! I still think his line wasn't that tight, but we are almost in agreement. 9% high F_cf is considerable, but again it still depends on actual entry line and resulting radii, would he have braked, would he only get off-throttle, etc...

Again, I'm unhappy with arbitrarily made steward's decision and resulting penalty. Norris made and error over the curb, understeered into Leclerc and got the same penalty, while being given ample space and being clearly slower.

As far as this incident goes, it's a racing incident of two hot heads in my view. Someone would assign more blame to Max, someone more to Hamilton, but FIA inconsistency with penalties is appalling.

Right after collision, still off track, LH went on the radio realy calm, it was just racing incident.
So no hot head, NO blaming, No disrespect to Max.
Than he asked about the state of cars floor and went racing again.
So much analysing...too much!!
It was cool race. And if this is prospect for next year, we f1 fans, should be really happy!
Ferr, Merc and RB fighting, with AM, Mcl and Alpine getting closer...

[Vanja #66]

Actually, he literally said it was not a racing incident... Doubled down later to declare himself as a "target"

[dans79]

Actually, he literally said it was not a racing incident... Doubled down later to declare himself as a "target"

Yea, and so did max with his stupid comment and smile about what it costs!

[harty71]

I don't know why this debate is going on, Max was the guilty party hence his penalty.

Of course they wouldn't have collided if Lewis just moved to the left and let him walk all over him, still, Max could have got out of it but he decided to go for it nevertheless.

[AR3-GP]

Actually, he literally said it was not a racing incident... Doubled down later to declare himself as a "target"

Yea, and so did max with his stupid comment and smile about what it costs!

This seems to be really bothering you? I wonder how we can resolve it.

[dans79]

Actually, he literally said it was not a racing incident... Doubled down later to declare himself as a "target"

Yea, and so did max with his stupid comment and smile about what it costs!

This seems to be really bothering you? I wonder how we can resolve it.

Nothing to resolve, I just find it fairly ridiculous that Max says and does stuff like that, then gets mad when he doesn't like the consequences of doing so!

https://www.racefans.net/2022/11/17/ver ... rders-row/

[GrizzleBoy]

So Red Bull have released a statement regarding the last lap events:

"

As a team we made some mistakes in Brazil. We had not envisaged the situation that unfolded on the last lap and we had not agreed a strategy for such a scenario before the race. Regretfully, Max was only informed at the final corner of the request to give up position without all the necessary information being relayed. This put Max, who has always been an open and fair team player, in a compromising situation with little time to react which was not our intention. Following the race Max spoke openly and honestly, allowing for both drivers to resolve any outstanding issues or concerns. The Team accept Max's reasoning, the conversation was a personal matter which will remain private between the team and no further comment will be made.

The events that followed from a social media point of view are completely unacceptable. The abusive online behaviour towards Max, Checo, the Team and their respective families is shocking and saddening and unfortunately is something that we as a sport are having to address with depressing regularity. There is no place for it in racing or society as a whole and we need to do and be better. At the end of the day this is a sport, we are here to race. Death threats, hate mail, vitriol towards extended family members is deplorable. We value inclusion and want a safe space for everyone to work in and enjoy our sport. The abuse needs to stop.

"


Smells like poo, doesn't it?

Copied from elsewhere:

"

listening back to the last lap on F1TV.

at turn 4 Max asks how many laps are left, GP tells him it's the last lap.

at turn 6-7, GP tells Max to let Checo through if he has not overtaken Alonso by turn 12 (the left hander before the long sweeping left to the finish).

after turn 13, GP tells Max to not worry about DRS and to let Perez past.

Turn 14-15, GP tells Verstappen twice to let Perez through.

On the cooldown lap at turn 3, GP asks Verstappen what happened and then Verstappen says "I already told you last summer, don't ask that again to me", okay? Are we clear about that?

At turn 4 Max says "I gave you my reasons and i stand by it!"

rest of the cooldown lap is silent except for an instruction to enter the pitlane.

"

Doesn't really match with what they're trying to go with in this statement does it?

Would probably have been better if they'd just said nothing.

Edit: I mean now I'm looking at the two things I quoted side by side, its just BS.

I cant even begin to imagine the gaslighting Ricciardo sat through after the Baku crash with Max.

[dans79]

Would probably have been better if they'd just said nothing.

Edit: I mean now I'm looking at the two things I quoted side by side, its just BS.

The PR department must live in a bubble and not realize several hundred thousand, if not millions of people have access to driver radio/audio via F1tv.

[PlatinumZealot]

A wheel or more will never work. That's even worse that the old rule that says it must be front wheel to side pod which is safer. Front wheel to rear wheel does not deserve any right to be given space. The attacker should back off at that point.

So you agree Silverstone 2021 was entirely Lewis' fault.

Lewis was initially alongside in the deceleration zone (That is where you take measurement) so the two are not the same. Max was even on the outside... And he turned in also.. So both cases are more leaning towards Max even though they are not similar.

[DDopey]

A wheel or more will never work. That's even worse that the old rule that says it must be front wheel to side pod which is safer. Front wheel to rear wheel does not deserve any right to be given space. The attacker should back off at that point.

So you agree Silverstone 2021 was entirely Lewis' fault.

Lewis was initially alongside in the deceleration zone (That is where you take measurement) so the two are not the same. Max was even on the outside... And he turned in also.. So both cases are more leaning towards Max even though they are not similar.

Lewis was never further alongside Max then Max was with Lewis in Brazil.

[dans79]

Lewis was never further alongside Max then Max was with Lewis in Brazil.

I think you are missing what he is saying. One, how and when you get along side plays a big part in who is at fault. Two, the rules related to passing are different from this year and last year.
https://www.racefans.net/2022/04/21/rac ... d-in-full/

[the poster below]

Would probably have been better if they'd just said nothing.

Edit: I mean now I'm looking at the two things I quoted side by side, its just BS.

The PR department must live in a bubble and not realize several hundred thousand, if not millions of people have access to driver radio/audio via F1tv.

I wish it was that. It's straight out of the Trump playbook - "alternative facts", having the last word, repeated often enough... History rewritten.

Can we get Russell to run some alternative lines and speeds through T1/T2 now?

Maybe the FIA should use a bank of data from all FP sessions that correlates fuel load, driving line, tyre age, tyre compound, track temperature, wind speed, wind direction and max speed carried through each corner for each car for a given track so that they can establish maximum speeds (with tolerances) for a series of entry angles on each corner and corresponding steering angle to actually make the corner in a given race, so that incidents in the race can be readily cross-checked for plausibility of an overtake attempt versus a dive-bomb, to aid decision making by the stewards.

Or maybe I'm feeling too optimistic. Would probably work for a dry weekend. Maybe it's overkill for what should be a good rivalry... Just wish we could see some prolonged wheel to wheel racing rather than single corner incidents.

[PlatinumZealot]

So you agree Silverstone 2021 was entirely Lewis' fault.

Lewis was initially alongside in the deceleration zone (That is where you take measurement) so the two are not the same. Max was even on the outside... And he turned in also.. So both cases are more leaning towards Max even though they are not similar.

Lewis was never further alongside Max then Max was with Lewis in Brazil.

In Brazil Max was on the outside and shot wide past the racing line to try to get his car ahead and turned back inwards towards another driver on the racing line. Problem was he was never fully along in the braking zone (in the second ess)

In SilverStone Max was on the racing line with another driver alongside on the inside. Then Max does the trick again where he shoots wide to get his car slightly ahead and turns in..... Problem was the inside dirver was already there fully along side in the braking zone.

So two different situaitons even tho Max tries a similar tactic.

Works in videogames... Not in real life.

[chrisc90]

There was no braking zone into turn 2....

[PlatinumZealot]

For me I agree with both decisions in Sillverstone 2021 and Brazil 2022.

I do not agree with Brazil 2021 however when Max went unpunished after repeated running off track.