2023 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Farnborough]

Also displays 28 kmh speed difference in same gear for very close rpm indicators doubt that's within range, unless there's something like a downchange blip going on, throttle trace only seems to show pedal and no evidence of rpm blips from gearchange paddle imposed modulation.

As noted, not really enough resolution to give analysis.

[mendis]

All you Brit fans of F1, hail the two time F1 Champion, Princess of Wales and bow!

[AR3-GP]

please delete

[AR3-GP]

To add, telemetry graph generated from fast f1 api (pretty much all of them on the internet these days, including F1-tempo for example) are most likely also not accurate enough for these pin-point comparisons.

This is from creator of fast f1, oehrly, himself:
It is extremely important to never assume that something is correct just because it looks right on the first glance. Often it is possible to validate the data “against itself” or just validate it logically. This may not always give absolute certainty that the results are accurate. But it can show when there are errors in the calculations. Or maybe the data is simply not accurate enough for what one is trying to do.

example of inaccuracy in f1-tempo's generated graphs (managed to fool myself even):
Perez' FP2 lap in melbourne as per official f1 on screen timings is 0.37 up on alonso's lap before being blocked:
https://i.imgur.com/HvySgI0.png

f1-tempo on the other hand thinks it's almost 0.6s up at that point:
https://i.imgur.com/2CS5PHZ.png

Only teams and FOM have access to telemetry accurate enough to make these precise comparisons. We've seen palmer use it a number of times and it also includes brake pressures among other things.

edit: please correct me I'm completely wrong... This may be a lifelong misunderstanding:

I think the .37 delta is Perez's delta for sector 2 alone. Your 6 tenths from F1 tempo includes the time delta from sector 2 AND sector 1.

I used F1- tempo to extract the sector 2 delta in isolation and got roughly .37s, as the F1 broadcast shows. Would this be a coincidence? or do I just have a fundamental misunderstanding somewhere?

[Juzh]

To add, telemetry graph generated from fast f1 api (pretty much all of them on the internet these days, including F1-tempo for example) are most likely also not accurate enough for these pin-point comparisons.

This is from creator of fast f1, oehrly, himself:
It is extremely important to never assume that something is correct just because it looks right on the first glance. Often it is possible to validate the data “against itself” or just validate it logically. This may not always give absolute certainty that the results are accurate. But it can show when there are errors in the calculations. Or maybe the data is simply not accurate enough for what one is trying to do.

example of inaccuracy in f1-tempo's generated graphs (managed to fool myself even):
Perez' FP2 lap in melbourne as per official f1 on screen timings is 0.37 up on alonso's lap before being blocked:
https://i.imgur.com/HvySgI0.png

f1-tempo on the other hand thinks it's almost 0.6s up at that point:
https://i.imgur.com/2CS5PHZ.png

Only teams and FOM have access to telemetry accurate enough to make these precise comparisons. We've seen palmer use it a number of times and it also includes brake pressures among other things.

edit: please correct me I'm completely wrong... This may be a lifelong misunderstanding:

I think the .37 delta is Perez's delta for sector 2 alone. Your 6 tenths from F1 tempo includes the time delta from sector 2 AND sector 1.

I used F1- tempo to extract the sector 2 delta in isolation and got roughly .37s, as the F1 broadcast shows. Would this be a coincidence? or do I just have a fundamental misunderstanding somewhere?

No -0.379 is up to that point, so after 2 sectors. I checked sector times just now to be sure.

[AR3-GP]

To add, telemetry graph generated from fast f1 api (pretty much all of them on the internet these days, including F1-tempo for example) are most likely also not accurate enough for these pin-point comparisons.

This is from creator of fast f1, oehrly, himself:
It is extremely important to never assume that something is correct just because it looks right on the first glance. Often it is possible to validate the data “against itself” or just validate it logically. This may not always give absolute certainty that the results are accurate. But it can show when there are errors in the calculations. Or maybe the data is simply not accurate enough for what one is trying to do.

example of inaccuracy in f1-tempo's generated graphs (managed to fool myself even):
Perez' FP2 lap in melbourne as per official f1 on screen timings is 0.37 up on alonso's lap before being blocked:
https://i.imgur.com/HvySgI0.png

f1-tempo on the other hand thinks it's almost 0.6s up at that point:
https://i.imgur.com/2CS5PHZ.png

Only teams and FOM have access to telemetry accurate enough to make these precise comparisons. We've seen palmer use it a number of times and it also includes brake pressures among other things.

edit: please correct me I'm completely wrong... This may be a lifelong misunderstanding:

I think the .37 delta is Perez's delta for sector 2 alone. Your 6 tenths from F1 tempo includes the time delta from sector 2 AND sector 1.

I used F1- tempo to extract the sector 2 delta in isolation and got roughly .37s, as the F1 broadcast shows. Would this be a coincidence? or do I just have a fundamental misunderstanding somewhere?

No -0.379 is up to that point, so after 2 sectors. I checked sector times just now to be sure.

lifelong misunderstanding confirmed

[kediown]

This is already known, but I think it may be delayed to Imola since they've been vocal about how Baku is a dangerous place for the cost cap

[organic]

This is already known, but I think it may be delayed to Imola since they've been vocal about how Baku is a dangerous place for the cost cap

I think it is possible they will be delayed, but unlikelu; with the sprint weekend, finding a setup quickly will be essential and damaging parts when spares are short is likely at Baku - doubly so with the sprint race.

[AR3-GP]

RB are in no rush to have upgrades. Would make sense if it is delayed.

[atanatizante]

What do you think guys about Mark Hughes` article regarding why the RB19 car has such an agressive anti-dive front and anti-squat rear suspension:

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... perez-mph/

[Farnborough]

What do you think guys about Mark Hughes` article regarding why the RB19 car has such an agressive anti-dive front and anti-squat rear suspension:

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... perez-mph/

I read through that and feel he's looking in a very very conventional optic as to how it's bring driven, particularly by MV.

I do agree that bringing up anti dive during braking makes it harder for the driver to determine with a degree of accurate finese just how close he is to locking.
In other words, increases performance, but trades that with feel dimished, especially if tyre is not brought to temp.
MV was more accomplished in handling that balance at various critical phase than SP.

The highest bonus for not letting the front dive is consistency in geometry of aero leading into the floor area I feel. Doesnt mean the floor is not shifting, but more that's principally achieved by rear jacking. That's an area they have huge experience of too in the significant rake attitude they've previously worked with.

[AR3-GP]

What do you think guys about Mark Hughes` article regarding why the RB19 car has such an agressive anti-dive front and anti-squat rear suspension:

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... perez-mph/

I read through that and feel he's looking in a very very conventional optic as to how it's bring driven, particularly by MV.

I do agree that bringing up anti dive during braking makes it harder for the driver to determine with a degree of accurate finese just how close he is to locking.
In other words, increases performance, but trades that with feel dimished, especially if tyre is not brought to temp.
MV was more accomplished in handling that balance at various critical phase than SP.

The highest bonus for not letting the front dive is consistency in geometry of aero leading into the floor area I feel. Doesnt mean the floor is not shifting, but more that's principally achieved by rear jacking. That's an area they have huge experience of too in the significant rake attitude they've previously worked with.

Technically speaking, his claim that anti-dive geometry has a great influence on front tire warming is not correct.

The longitudinal load transfer of these F1 cars is dominated by the deceleration value, not the very minor changes in CG height associated with dive/anti-dive especially since the cars are stiffly sprung and rise at the rear is somewhat counteracted by dive at the front.

[organic]

First driver in 45 years to win on Super formula debut... I am sure Marko will be considering the alpha tauri/de vries situation carefully

With no free practice (cancelled) he qualified 3rd, 2 tenths off 2x reigning WDC Nojiri, his teammate, on pole. Overtook p2 on track and undercut Nojiri then pulled 5s gap in 10 laps. Very impressive

[AR3-GP]

First driver in 45 years to win on Super formula debut... I am sure Marko will be considering the alpha tauri/de vries situation carefully

Lawson drove two free practice sessions last year. 1 for AT and 1 for RB so RB already have some idea of what he would do.

[organic]

First driver in 45 years to win on Super formula debut... I am sure Marko will be considering the alpha tauri/de vries situation carefully

Lawson drove two free practice sessions last year. 1 for AT and 1 for RB so RB already have some idea of what he would do.

Indeed. Marko said Lawson's pace with the F1 cars was impressive which is why they bothered to put him in SF. They have many characteristics closer to F1 than F2 does. The aero especially.

Lawson was very quick in his F1 test. He will be driving in Japan next year

And Lawson on SF vs F2

“One of the most frustrating things is the difference between an F2 car and F1, and how your suitability for F1 can be judged from F2. Super Formula is closer to F1, and people are aware of that fact,”