Red Bull RB19

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
Farnborough
Farnborough
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Joined: 18 Mar 2023, 14:15

Re: Red Bull RB19

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In post above, is anyone else getting the impression the exhaust pipe is smaller at the opening (very marginally) than the bore size further back toward the engine ?

It's odd because from pure image recording (optical geometry) the end nearest to camera "should" look the largest in perspective.

I know these dimension are tightly controlled in regard to the specification, also for vertical alignment etc, but it appears slightly different.

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organic
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Joined: 08 Jan 2022, 02:24
Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Yes the monkey seat is new for the rb19. Is visible on their high df beam wing that they've used since Bahrain:

Pic from preseason testing with monkey seat present

Image

Feature was not present on high df BW in '22.

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Vanja #66
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Joined: 19 Mar 2012, 16:38

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Also a feature inspired by competitors, as is the diffuser corner geometry :p

Image

When you have only two pick up points for top beam wing (one on each endplate) it's easier to let it flex :wink:
AeroGimli.x

And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

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organic
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Re: Red Bull RB19

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Nicolas Carpentiers 📸

A good comparison of the new diffuser geometry with the pre-barcelona diffuser. The corner geometry has completely changed: the RB used the curved corner since launch RB18 and was an outlier in this regard. Now they have finally adopted the squarer shape that was predicted prior to 2022 which maximizes usage of the legality volume.

I believe if the squarer shape is to be achieved, the inwards bulge is required prior to the final diffuser kick due to stringent minimum radius rules in this region. But this may be incorrect if someone more knowledgeable with the regulations knows better

Image

As previously stated, the edge wing has changed. This is not a novel comparison nor a novel conclusion but hopefully some crude annotations will help add a bit of accessibility to the understanding of the geometry. It could be perceived as adding a strake.. but if you follow each edge of the edge wing carefully the edge wing is essentially twisted such that the underside of the edge wing becomes the top and vice versa:

Image

This probably allows them to crank their edge wing harder without having to attach lossy metal strakes to the underside of the edge wing

Not 100% sure if the purple edges connect up on the updated edge wing (but this is not visible). Regardless, the underside of the edge wing is far more complicated and this gives a decent view of how it might be working

*Reposted with pc annotated images rather than phone

Edit:

In hindsight, perhaps this is a possible geometry as well

Image

With the red edge originating in a strake on the underside, and the green edge merging with the purple edge which removes the possibility of the twist occurring
Last edited by organic on 07 Jun 2023, 14:12, edited 1 time in total.

dialtone
dialtone
121
Joined: 25 Feb 2019, 01:31

Re: Red Bull RB19

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organic wrote:Nicolas Carpentiers

A good comparison of the new diffuser geometry with the pre-barcelona diffuser. The corner geometry has completely changed: the RB used the curved corner since launch RB18 and was an outlier in this regard. Now they have finally adopted the squarer shape that was predicted prior to 2022 which maximizes usage of the legality volume.

I believe if the squarer shape is to be achieved, the inwards bulge is required prior to the final diffuser kick due to stringent minimum radius rules in this region. But this may be incorrect if someone more knowledgeable with the regulations knows better

Image

As previously stated, the edge wing has changed. This is not a novel comparison nor a novel conclusion but hopefully some crude annotations will help add a bit of accessibility to the understanding of the geometry. It could be perceived as adding a strake.. but if you follow each edge of the edge wing carefully the edge wing is essentially twisted such that the underside of the edge wing becomes the top and vice versa:

Image

This probably allows them to crank their edge wing harder without having to attach lossy metal strakes to the underside of the edge wing

Not 100% sure if the purple edges connect up on the updated edge wing (but this is not visible). Regardless, the underside of the edge wing is far more complicated and this gives a decent view of how it might be working

*Reposted with pc annotated images rather than phone
That edge wing is so nice. I know nothing of aerodynamic design but the torsion really feels like it’s generating the vortex while massaging the flow to seal the back of the diffuser from tire squirt. This may be totally wrong but the amount of 3d structures that RBR uses feels like they are using a completely different cfd software for modeling. That they have the same computational limits as everyone else feels almost unbelievable.

Tip of the hat, this one detail more than anything in the car feels magic to me.

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dren
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Joined: 03 Mar 2010, 14:14

Re: Red Bull RB19

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I don't think you drew that Barcelona one correctly. It looks like they bent the front component more to make a sharp transition at the lower part.
Honda!

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organic
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Joined: 08 Jan 2022, 02:24
Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: Red Bull RB19

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dren wrote:
07 Jun 2023, 13:58
I don't think you drew that Barcelona one correctly. It looks like they bent the front component more to make a sharp transition at the lower part.
fully open to this being totally wrong :D as working with this strange geometry is just speculative.. However I don't understand exactly what you're getting at - can you illustrate it please?

Looking at it with fresh eyes.. Perhaps this geometry is also possible? with the green edge curling inwards to join the purple edge which continuously runs inboard whilst the new outboard edge originates with a strake on the underside of the wing

Image

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Another angle.
Image
A lion must kill its prey.

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organic
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Re: Red Bull RB19

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I give up :D I am confident that both of my interpretations were incorrect with that additional angle taken into account.

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Joined: 06 Jul 2021, 01:22

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Another angle from Fabrega. I'm not too sure how these pieces are joined.

Image
A lion must kill its prey.

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PlatinumZealot
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Joined: 12 Jun 2008, 03:45

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Chuckjr wrote:
03 Jun 2023, 09:14
SiLo wrote:
01 Jun 2023, 10:31
https://i.imgur.com/lC9yt9E.png

Just trying to highlight some of the curvatures of their underfloor.
Could it be RB are using the steps in the floor to reduce drag in a similar philosophy used in boats to reduce drag?

“The most recent change in this design over the past decade has been the incorporation of strategically placed notches or steps in the hull. The steps create air bubbles, raising the hull off the water on a drag-reducing cushion.”

https://tntcustommarine.com/2019/06/hi- ... ull-types/

And here:
In that very same video "increased resistance to porpoising" was given as an advantage of a stepped hull in boats. Whether this translates to a car floor remains to be explained by someone expert in fluid dynamics.
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marcel171281
marcel171281
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Joined: 22 Feb 2020, 12:08

Re: Red Bull RB19

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AR3-GP wrote:
08 Jun 2023, 01:27
Another angle from Fabrega. I'm not too sure how these pieces are joined.

https://i.redd.it/albert-fabrega-red-bu ... 628f6ff7a9
Looks like one of those Escher drawings :lol:

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: Red Bull RB19

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organic wrote:
07 Jun 2023, 14:02

Image

with the green edge curling inwards to join the purple edge which continuously runs inboard whilst the new outboard edge originates with a strake on the underside of the wing
I think this is the correct one with the modification that the green edge does not join the purple edge in the right side of the picture. The green edge simply blends/diffuses into the cambered interior section of the floor edge body and ceases to exist.

Image

Image

Image
A lion must kill its prey.

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deadhead
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Re: Red Bull RB19

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Image

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organic
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Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: Red Bull RB19

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Image

Wing element reprofiling for more front downforce. Will make a comparison soon.