Massa crashes after being hit by heave spring

[timbo]

I guess Charlie Whiting will decide on whether a test driver can drive given the special circumstances. But what would be the point? He would have to start from the back of the grid and would surely score no points.

Sponsor exposure...

[mx_tifoso]

When was the last time a team raced with only one driver? Rough date and team...

[jonathan189]

Despite two recent occurrences these are still freak accidents - the equivalent of being struck twice by lightning.

No it's not, because the source of the danger is controllable and the risks can be reduced.

[timbo]

When was the last time a team raced with only one driver? Rough date and team...

Probably Sauber? 1994

[jonathan189]

New press release: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpres ... dX29T2GUHA

Felipe Massa remains in a stable condition in hospital after fracturing his skull in two places during a freak accident in qualifying for the Hungarian Grand Prix.

A Ferrari statement read: "After undergoing an operation on Saturday afternoon, Felipe Massa's condition remains stable and there were no further complications through the night.

"He will be given another CT scan which will provide more precise information."

[xpensive]

With running the risk of coming across as uncompassionate, any takers on a wager that Jaques Villeneuve will make a return to F1 in a red no 27 car within soon?

[Tim.Wright]

myurr has been the only person on this post (from my reading) who has touched on this, but I think that the helmet strength is the main contributor to the accident. Apologies to anyone else who also meantioned it, but I've only read about 6 pages of posts :-p

Pictures show a 'spring sized' hole in massas helmet which suggests to me that the helmet, as a whole, did not help dissipate the energy of the spring. From my very limted experience with composites and ballistics, the more surface area allowed to deform, the better the ballistics performance.

Taking it to the extreme, if the helmet was 100% ballistics grade kevlar, you might have seen a larger damaged area of the helmet but hopefully no penetration. Thats what kevlar is good at. unfortunately it would be very heavy.

In short, I think a stronger helmet would have prevented this.

Tim

[di44ety]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HST7QvnRbvs[/youtube]

[timbo]

With running the risk of coming across as uncompassionate, any takers on a wager that Jaques Villeneuve will make a return to F1 in a red no 27 car within soon?

Ferrari may have N27 only if they somehow finish 14th in WCC. With only 10 teams this year and 13 next, I think that is improbable.

PS they don't have N13, so I guess they only need to finish 13th... Well, seems like for 2011 it is possible

[modbaraban]

With running the risk of coming across as uncompassionate, any takers on a wager that Jaques Villeneuve will make a return to F1 in a red no 27 car within soon?

No. Ferrari have good test drivers and testing is what they need so bad now (just like everyone else really).

I don't think there's a safety issue with the helmets. They are amazingly strong. Someone mentioned on this thread the idea to move the roll hoop forward. A roll hoop above and around the driver's head plus a proper windshield (60-s style) that would deflect any debris upwards and above the helmet, I think would be the right way to go.

[mep]

It is amazing how much bullshit is written in this threat.

Massa got hit by a mass of around 1kg with a speed of approximated 255km/h.
That is a massive impact on a helmet and that is the reason for his injuries.
From this moment on he was obviously out of consciousness but slightly on the brakes
and never on full throttle.

If the brakes where full operated, the tires would have had enough grip to slow the car down.
Saying the car had no grip is nonsense because the tires would have looked then.

Nevertheless the car slowed down a bit.
The impact on the tire walls wasn't that hard, because they are really soft.
They take the energy over a relatively far distance.
Just have a look on the nose of the car. It is not damaged that much.
So it could protect the driver from a heavier impact like the one from Kubica.

I don't know how the HANS worked but so does none of us.
I am sure it is state of the art and absolutely safe.
This means that it was not damaged or something like this.
Maybe it can't do his job 100% when the driver is out of consciousness.
For one thing I am sure HANS should not hold the drivers head 100% rigid on the place, because this would be really bad.
The head still needs some movement to reduce the G loads on the head.
Inside the head is the brain bedded in liquid.
With a to stiff HANS the brain will hit the skull really hard and that effects sever brain injuries.
So don't blame the HANS or the belts.

I rather wonder how a spring can come loose of the car.
I really want to see how the spring arrangement of the brawns is done because naturally are the springs placed around the dampers and are really bedded in the car.

[kilcoo316]

No knee jerk reactions please.


2 similar incidents in 2 weeks after no notable occurrences for years still makes it just 2 freak accidents.

Unless you demand the windscreen be raised significantly and extended around the frontal hemisphere of the driver, there is little that can be done to prevent a small object from getting to the driver's crash helmet.

[jonathan189]

there is little that can be done to prevent a small object from getting to the driver's crash helmet.

But rather than stopping there, why not think about those "little" things that can be done, see if they are practicable, and then do them?

Motor racing is dangerous, but fatalities don't automatically have to be a part of it. Risks can be minimized.

[di44ety]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am1j--89DAA[/youtube]
Spring of BRAWN

[Tim.Wright]

I don't think there's a safety issue with the helmets. They are amazingly strong...

The helmet failed, the spring hit him in the head. They are obvisously not designed for that kind of impact. How can you say there is no safety issue with the helmets?

That video is wrong too, the spring hit the car first twice. In front of the cockpit and then into the lateral head protection then his helmet. See formula1.com You can see the mark the spring leaves on the cockpit edge in the video

Tim