Christian Horner under Investigation

[f1jcw]

Even if he was against BLM he still shouldn't have been cancelled, not agreeing with the crowd or someones political views, shouldn't be a reason.

But Horner isn't being cancelled, he is under investigation for workplace misconduct.

[stewie325]

You realise it’s the capitalist system that would result in an early exit? Red Bull are an advertising agency that happens to sell soft drinks.

And yet whenever I hear "Red Bull", I never think about the drink any more, but instead of their very successful F1 team (and soon to be engine manufacturer). That's one marketing strategy gone wrong! Sticking to topic, it would be a shame for one of the instrumental people in "the soft drinks company's" F1 success to leave this way.

[koolway]

(include all the *IFs* necessary to confirm what has leaked) He got himself in that position like a big boy.... one way or another, you have to take responsibility for your actions.
The shame would be not to assume those...

[Redragon]

I feel like, whatever actually happened between Horner and the woman, his position is becoming untenable due to the negative PR it is attracting.

Pure cancel culture that. If he is found to have done something wrong, sure. Otherwise he should be backed and up to him if he wants to continue or not.

It's how the world has been for years and years now. If people think they live in actual democratic freedom of speech countries, they're deluded, you just have to have the wrong PERCEIVED (or real) conduct or opinion, you're canceled.

A personal experience:
I was accused of harrassment to a costumer. Didn't do nothing wrong just couldn't answer the question she was asking as I didn't know the information she was after. I was behind the counter far from her. we were alone on the store. She called the police and accuse me of harrasment. while waiting for the police I remained calm and behind the counter and always on CCTV view. 10 min came the police, they when straight to me to arrest me without questioning but then when questioning the lady they realise that she has track record of lying and mental health problems, she is a patient on a mental health hospital. At that moment the police relise me and stop the arrest. Never had a proper appologies from UK police and for 10 min i was the horrible human being that harrassed this women. All without checking details or proof. For those to jump into conclusions before proven guilty would regret it when it happen to them and are on same situation, would be asking for justice. Mine was a lucky scape. On this case Horner. would not arrive into conclusion until the report is out. If guilty hope gets his punishment but if not guilty we will see if those on the wrong side would ever appologise.

[astracrazy]

I feel like, whatever actually happened between Horner and the woman, his position is becoming untenable due to the negative PR it is attracting.

Pure cancel culture that. If he is found to have done something wrong, sure. Otherwise he should be backed and up to him if he wants to continue or not.

Maybe, but it is also just simply PR. You don't want someone who is perceived to have done something as the face of your company.

I play guitar and there's a pedal maker called Mike Fuller who got "cancelled" during the BLM riots after he spoke out about the effect on small business owners of the rioting. He has since had the opportunity to explain what he meant, that he was not criticising what the BLM movement stood for, but just pointing out that it was costing small business owners their livelihoods etc. Yet still some retailers will not stock his products. And he did not do anything wrong, simply had a comment taken out of context.

I don't agree with it (in the Mike Fuller situation I simply say to people - if you don't like him, don't buy his products) but that is how the world of business works.

Red Bull are no longer the sole name people think of for energy drinks. Indeed they are second in terms of market share after Monster. They may not even want to be associated with someone who is even perceived to have done what the rumours say Horner might have done.

But that's just a ridiculous thing to say and would be a dangerous precedent to set for Red Bull, or any company, that your gone even if you are found to have done nothing wrong. Would you accept that attitude from your employer? Would you even want to work for an employer that you knew had that attitude?

That would play into the rumours that this is all a stitch up and IF Horner is found to have done nothing wrong then I think it would actually be a bigger PR disaster for Red Bull if they got rid of him.

Time moves on and people quickly forget. Look at Antony the footballer. A small loud minority would of had it he never kicked a football again based on accusations alone. Accusations were dropped and he still plays. No one is talking about it, no sponsors left, no one is calling for him to never play again.

[PapayaFan481]

Pure cancel culture that. If he is found to have done something wrong, sure. Otherwise he should be backed and up to him if he wants to continue or not.

Maybe, but it is also just simply PR. You don't want someone who is perceived to have done something as the face of your company.

I play guitar and there's a pedal maker called Mike Fuller who got "cancelled" during the BLM riots after he spoke out about the effect on small business owners of the rioting. He has since had the opportunity to explain what he meant, that he was not criticising what the BLM movement stood for, but just pointing out that it was costing small business owners their livelihoods etc. Yet still some retailers will not stock his products. And he did not do anything wrong, simply had a comment taken out of context.

I don't agree with it (in the Mike Fuller situation I simply say to people - if you don't like him, don't buy his products) but that is how the world of business works.

Red Bull are no longer the sole name people think of for energy drinks. Indeed they are second in terms of market share after Monster. They may not even want to be associated with someone who is even perceived to have done what the rumours say Horner might have done.

But that's just a ridiculous thing to say and would be a dangerous precedent to set for Red Bull, or any company, that your gone even if you are found to have done nothing wrong. Would you accept that attitude from your employer? Would you even want to work for an employer that you knew had that attitude?

That would play into the rumours that this is all a stitch up and IF Horner is found to have done nothing wrong then I think it would actually be a bigger PR disaster for Red Bull if they got rid of him.

Time moves on and people quickly forget. Look at Antony the footballer. A small loud minority would of had it he never kicked a football again based on accusations alone. Accusations were dropped and he still plays. No one is talking about it, no sponsors left, no one is calling for him to never play again.

In my industry people are immediately suspended for any suggestion of impropriety, all the way up to the most senior level, whilst it is investigated. They don't have a PR machine and millions of pounds to try and pay people off.

I don't know who this footballer you speak of is, I would watch paint dry before watching that sport as it simply does not interest me in the slightest.

[PapayaFan481]

Pure cancel culture that. If he is found to have done something wrong, sure. Otherwise he should be backed and up to him if he wants to continue or not.

It's how the world has been for years and years now. If people think they live in actual democratic freedom of speech countries, they're deluded, you just have to have the wrong PERCEIVED (or real) conduct or opinion, you're canceled.

A personal experience:
I was accused of harrassment to a costumer. Didn't do nothing wrong just couldn't answer the question she was asking as I didn't know the information she was after. I was behind the counter far from her. we were alone on the store. She called the police and accuse me of harrasment. while waiting for the police I remained calm and behind the counter and always on CCTV view. 10 min came the police, they when straight to me to arrest me without questioning but then when questioning the lady they realise that she has track record of lying and mental health problems, she is a patient on a mental health hospital. At that moment the police relise me and stop the arrest. Never had a proper appologies from UK police and for 10 min i was the horrible human being that harrassed this women. All without checking details or proof. For those to jump into conclusions before proven guilty would regret it when it happen to them and are on same situation, would be asking for justice. Mine was a lucky scape. On this case Horner. would not arrive into conclusion until the report is out. If guilty hope gets his punishment but if not guilty we will see if those on the wrong side would ever appologise.

The Police didn't do anything wrong in your scenario, so why would they apologise? You weren't charged and were released as soon as the facts became clear. They have processes in place to allow them to preserve evidence. There is a perception that they are being heavy handed or presuming guilt, they are not, they are treating all accused people the same way because that is their SOP.

[astracrazy]

Maybe, but it is also just simply PR. You don't want someone who is perceived to have done something as the face of your company.

I play guitar and there's a pedal maker called Mike Fuller who got "cancelled" during the BLM riots after he spoke out about the effect on small business owners of the rioting. He has since had the opportunity to explain what he meant, that he was not criticising what the BLM movement stood for, but just pointing out that it was costing small business owners their livelihoods etc. Yet still some retailers will not stock his products. And he did not do anything wrong, simply had a comment taken out of context.

I don't agree with it (in the Mike Fuller situation I simply say to people - if you don't like him, don't buy his products) but that is how the world of business works.

Red Bull are no longer the sole name people think of for energy drinks. Indeed they are second in terms of market share after Monster. They may not even want to be associated with someone who is even perceived to have done what the rumours say Horner might have done.

But that's just a ridiculous thing to say and would be a dangerous precedent to set for Red Bull, or any company, that your gone even if you are found to have done nothing wrong. Would you accept that attitude from your employer? Would you even want to work for an employer that you knew had that attitude?

That would play into the rumours that this is all a stitch up and IF Horner is found to have done nothing wrong then I think it would actually be a bigger PR disaster for Red Bull if they got rid of him.

Time moves on and people quickly forget. Look at Antony the footballer. A small loud minority would of had it he never kicked a football again based on accusations alone. Accusations were dropped and he still plays. No one is talking about it, no sponsors left, no one is calling for him to never play again.

In my industry people are immediately suspended for any suggestion of impropriety, all the way up to the most senior level, whilst it is investigated. They don't have a PR machine and millions of pounds to try and pay people off.

I don't know who this footballer you speak of is, I would watch paint dry before watching that sport as it simply does not interest me in the slightest.

Yeah which is fine and standard procedure, but we are talking post investigation, where if found innocent you would suggest they are fired anyway. Which I find an amazing concept. 100% one of those "until it happens to you" scenarios.

....if you like football or not is irrelevant to the point.

[Hammerfist]

It's how the world has been for years and years now. If people think they live in actual democratic freedom of speech countries, they're deluded, you just have to have the wrong PERCEIVED (or real) conduct or opinion, you're canceled.

A personal experience:
I was accused of harrassment to a costumer. Didn't do nothing wrong just couldn't answer the question she was asking as I didn't know the information she was after. I was behind the counter far from her. we were alone on the store. She called the police and accuse me of harrasment. while waiting for the police I remained calm and behind the counter and always on CCTV view. 10 min came the police, they when straight to me to arrest me without questioning but then when questioning the lady they realise that she has track record of lying and mental health problems, she is a patient on a mental health hospital. At that moment the police relise me and stop the arrest. Never had a proper appologies from UK police and for 10 min i was the horrible human being that harrassed this women. All without checking details or proof. For those to jump into conclusions before proven guilty would regret it when it happen to them and are on same situation, would be asking for justice. Mine was a lucky scape. On this case Horner. would not arrive into conclusion until the report is out. If guilty hope gets his punishment but if not guilty we will see if those on the wrong side would ever appologise.

The Police didn't do anything wrong in your scenario, so why would they apologise? You weren't charged and were released as soon as the facts became clear. They have processes in place to allow them to preserve evidence. There is a perception that they are being heavy handed or presuming guilt, they are not, they are treating all accused people the same way because that is their SOP.

They did do something wrong. They arrested him wringly based on word of mouth of this lady. There was no proof.
OP should sue the police imo.

[dans79]

Per Horner the investigation isn't over yet.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2024/ ... -future-f1

“There is a process going on which I form part of and as I form part of that process, I am afraid I cannot comment on it,” he said. “Everybody would like a conclusion as soon as possible. But I am really not at liberty to comment about the process.”

[PapayaFan481]

A personal experience:
I was accused of harrassment to a costumer. Didn't do nothing wrong just couldn't answer the question she was asking as I didn't know the information she was after. I was behind the counter far from her. we were alone on the store. She called the police and accuse me of harrasment. while waiting for the police I remained calm and behind the counter and always on CCTV view. 10 min came the police, they when straight to me to arrest me without questioning but then when questioning the lady they realise that she has track record of lying and mental health problems, she is a patient on a mental health hospital. At that moment the police relise me and stop the arrest. Never had a proper appologies from UK police and for 10 min i was the horrible human being that harrassed this women. All without checking details or proof. For those to jump into conclusions before proven guilty would regret it when it happen to them and are on same situation, would be asking for justice. Mine was a lucky scape. On this case Horner. would not arrive into conclusion until the report is out. If guilty hope gets his punishment but if not guilty we will see if those on the wrong side would ever appologise.

The Police didn't do anything wrong in your scenario, so why would they apologise? You weren't charged and were released as soon as the facts became clear. They have processes in place to allow them to preserve evidence. There is a perception that they are being heavy handed or presuming guilt, they are not, they are treating all accused people the same way because that is their SOP.

They did do something wrong. They arrested him wringly based on word of mouth of this lady. There was no proof.
OP should sue the police imo.

Would be laughed out of court. Unless OP was charged, they wouldn't have a case.

[PapayaFan481]

But that's just a ridiculous thing to say and would be a dangerous precedent to set for Red Bull, or any company, that your gone even if you are found to have done nothing wrong. Would you accept that attitude from your employer? Would you even want to work for an employer that you knew had that attitude?

That would play into the rumours that this is all a stitch up and IF Horner is found to have done nothing wrong then I think it would actually be a bigger PR disaster for Red Bull if they got rid of him.

Time moves on and people quickly forget. Look at Antony the footballer. A small loud minority would of had it he never kicked a football again based on accusations alone. Accusations were dropped and he still plays. No one is talking about it, no sponsors left, no one is calling for him to never play again.

In my industry people are immediately suspended for any suggestion of impropriety, all the way up to the most senior level, whilst it is investigated. They don't have a PR machine and millions of pounds to try and pay people off.

I don't know who this footballer you speak of is, I would watch paint dry before watching that sport as it simply does not interest me in the slightest.

Yeah which is fine and standard procedure, but we are talking post investigation, where if found innocent you would suggest they are fired anyway. Which I find an amazing concept. 100% one of those "until it happens to you" scenarios.

....if you like football or not is irrelevant to the point.

You used a footballer as an example, I was just pointing out that I couldn't relate to that example as I have no idea who that person is or what they did etc.

I am not saying I agree with it, but the nature of the beast with PR is that mud sticks, especially when it is something like sexual harassment. Add in the rumour that Horner attempted to pay the woman off.....there may always be doubt in the minds of some people and, in a post "Me Too" era, that can be enough when you're such a public facing person.

[wogx]

[Wouter]

Dutch (often unreliable) pit reporter Jack Plooij from Bahrain last night at Ziggo TV about Horner:
"I understand that it will be known this week what his future will be at RBR."

He was there during the last few test days and will remain there until the GP weekend, so that should be before Thursday,
because that's when FP1 starts, maybe even before the Mediaday on Wednesday.

I think this information is reliable for once.

[Zynerji]

I had a thought this am about this situation.

Going total tin-foil hat here, but hear me out.

Honda + RBR win championship. Honda pull out of F1
Honda transfers IP to RBT
RBT sign with Ford for 2026.
Honda want back in, but RBR has a new partner, so they sign with AM.
RBR trigger HR investigation and hype it in the media to force Ford to walk away due to image problems.
Investigation ends inconclusively and is settled internally.
RBR Honda is a thing again.