2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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TeamKoolGreen wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 16:36
Piastri is struggling pretty hard. Getting beat by Alpines while his teammate is getting wins, poles and podiums. But nobody cares. He's not George Russell :D

It is normal to have a sophomore struggle. And it's good that Piastri is getting his space. I just don't like double standards.
In what way is he struggling? To my mind he had one bad race. Worth pointing out that George had 3 years with Williams before going to the sharp end of the grid.

For me, Oscar is doing very well. You can see he has the same raw pace of the top talent in F1. You can see his tyre and race management continue to improve. I'm not perturbed by a bad weekend, he's had very few so I've no reason to think it will become a problem.

He's lost points and positions due to luck and circumstance, like the Miami reversal due to SC. It's how it goes, but he seems to be doing what he needs to do in the car.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

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Emag
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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Image

Just amazing pace by Norris all the way through. It's particularly interesting to look at the gap to Leclerc, because both were on comparable strategies, and despite having to go through traffic in his second stint (from lap 36 after he cleared George and Lewis, he was going much quicker), Lando was 2 tenths quicker in the middle stint (on average).

Difference when both were on clear air with used softs at the end goes up to 4 tenths.

I am actually surprised the race pace turned out to be this good compared to Ferrari.

LionsHeart
LionsHeart
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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Emag wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 20:17
https://i.imgur.com/hAOGMsP.png

Just amazing pace by Norris all the way through. It's particularly interesting to look at the gap to Leclerc, because both were on comparable strategies, and despite having to go through traffic in his second stint (from lap 36 after he cleared George and Lewis, he was going much quicker), Lando was 2 tenths quicker in the middle stint (on average).

Difference when both were on clear air with used softs at the end goes up to 4 tenths.

I am actually surprised the race pace turned out to be this good compared to Ferrari.
Good table. Convenient and clear. It is nice to realize that McLaren has reached the top level in pure speed. Let's see what happens if the team brings updates to Silverstone. To what extent this can be enough for the team to fight for victories with a reserve.

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mwillems
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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LionsHeart wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 16:05
mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 15:48
SilviuAgo wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 13:52


Although mwillems said to keep it shorter :D I had the pleasure (and patience :) ) to read all this post and, instead of reading 10 pages of 100 posts saying also some crazy stuff, this is a well done summary of what happened this race and what is next. Chapeau Mr LionsHeart =D>

I really hope RedBull Ring will be kind to McLaren and, if last year in Hungary I had the opportunity to see Lando P2, this time I hope to see live a P1. And if is both in Sprint and Main Race...then I will not say no :wink:
I think it is best to wait and see what happens at Austria. I see another post suggesting RB might struggle there due to the kerbs, but Canada should be putting those predictions on hold.

No idea what others will do, but I'm certain that Mclaren will be very much in the mix again and possibly we might even sneak the title of favourites...
War and Peace. Leo Tolstoy.


:D
Enough. My stomach hurts from laughing.

Is it nice to know that the team has climbed out of the midfield? I read Carlos' interview today, he said that he was impressed with McLaren's consistency. After all, in the last six races McLaren has had at least one car in the top two at the finish. It's a bit reminiscent of last season, when Lando had a lot of second places in the race.
I thought you'd appreciate the Russian author. I never read it, but Anna Karenina I did enjoy a lot.

Yeah they are doing well. It'll be interesting to see what the teams bring over the next races and where that affects the order.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

Mostlyeels
Mostlyeels
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 08:35
It's just that we will likely lose the close racing for a few years. That's why I'd like these rules a bit longer.
I reckon for the rest of this year (fingers crossed), and next year, the gaps will be wafer thin, and it'll be the type of racing I really enjoy: competitive but not dominant. It is a lot of fun, trying to work out which car and driver will have the edge at which track, and in which conditions.

I wouldn't mind a year of dominant McLaren of course :)

LionsHeart
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 22:57
LionsHeart wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 16:05
mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 15:48


I think it is best to wait and see what happens at Austria. I see another post suggesting RB might struggle there due to the kerbs, but Canada should be putting those predictions on hold.

No idea what others will do, but I'm certain that Mclaren will be very much in the mix again and possibly we might even sneak the title of favourites...
War and Peace. Leo Tolstoy.


:D
Enough. My stomach hurts from laughing.

Is it nice to know that the team has climbed out of the midfield? I read Carlos' interview today, he said that he was impressed with McLaren's consistency. After all, in the last six races McLaren has had at least one car in the top two at the finish. It's a bit reminiscent of last season, when Lando had a lot of second places in the race.
I thought you'd appreciate the Russian author. I never read it, but Anna Karenina I did enjoy a lot.

Yeah they are doing well. It'll be interesting to see what the teams bring over the next races and where that affects the order.
And I appreciated it. We read most of these books back in school during literature lessons. However, I can't say that I like War and Peace. It is written in a heavy language and it is a bit difficult to keep the thoughts in your head. To understand all the subtleties that the writer has laid out.

I just liked the way you turned my message around very briefly and added "The End" at the end. You know, in school we sometimes used to do other things, like a short summary, to better understand certain literary works. It allowed us to shorten the reading time and better understand the meaning of what was written. The way you wrote it is very competent. It explains everything in a nutshell and overall it turned out to be a good reference.

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mwillems
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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LionsHeart wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 10:17
mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 22:57
LionsHeart wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 16:05


War and Peace. Leo Tolstoy.


:D
Enough. My stomach hurts from laughing.

Is it nice to know that the team has climbed out of the midfield? I read Carlos' interview today, he said that he was impressed with McLaren's consistency. After all, in the last six races McLaren has had at least one car in the top two at the finish. It's a bit reminiscent of last season, when Lando had a lot of second places in the race.
I thought you'd appreciate the Russian author. I never read it, but Anna Karenina I did enjoy a lot.

Yeah they are doing well. It'll be interesting to see what the teams bring over the next races and where that affects the order.
And I appreciated it. We read most of these books back in school during literature lessons. However, I can't say that I like War and Peace. It is written in a heavy language and it is a bit difficult to keep the thoughts in your head. To understand all the subtleties that the writer has laid out.

I just liked the way you turned my message around very briefly and added "The End" at the end. You know, in school we sometimes used to do other things, like a short summary, to better understand certain literary works. It allowed us to shorten the reading time and better understand the meaning of what was written. The way you wrote it is very competent. It explains everything in a nutshell and overall it turned out to be a good reference.
:D :D

I did read your message, and I also summarised it in ChatGPT just because I was interested. I agree with what you are saying. But I don't know that it was obvious that the offset was a good idea. I thought they were going to stretch to a one stop on the softs by going another 4 laps. It certainly seemed like they could. The offset will usually be inherently slower. In this case, I think it was Lando's driving and the car being good on the tyres which got us more laps at the end of the stints before the tyres plateaued to run at smaller but quicker delta to those around us.

One thing I did not consider in the race was how strong of an effect the dirty air was having on the tyre temps, and I think this is what brought us the time and made it work. The Delta helped us get past people. More people than if we'd pitted earlier. But it ensured we'd get past them and into clean air, where the tyre temps would be lower and the car pushed to go faster whilst still managing the tyres.

I knew the dirty air was affecting us, but I thought it was from an aero point of view because I've seen this car struggle all season in dirty air. I still think the aero struggles a little more in dirty air than we'd like (outside of tyre temperatures), but predominantly the gift in this race was tyre temps as once again... this race was all about the tyres.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

LionsHeart
LionsHeart
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Joined: 09 Mar 2023, 19:21

Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 10:28
LionsHeart wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 10:17
mwillems wrote:
24 Jun 2024, 22:57


I thought you'd appreciate the Russian author. I never read it, but Anna Karenina I did enjoy a lot.

Yeah they are doing well. It'll be interesting to see what the teams bring over the next races and where that affects the order.
And I appreciated it. We read most of these books back in school during literature lessons. However, I can't say that I like War and Peace. It is written in a heavy language and it is a bit difficult to keep the thoughts in your head. To understand all the subtleties that the writer has laid out.

I just liked the way you turned my message around very briefly and added "The End" at the end. You know, in school we sometimes used to do other things, like a short summary, to better understand certain literary works. It allowed us to shorten the reading time and better understand the meaning of what was written. The way you wrote it is very competent. It explains everything in a nutshell and overall it turned out to be a good reference.
:D :D

I did read your message, and I also summarised it in ChatGPT just because I was interested. I agree with what you are saying. But I don't know that it was obvious that the offset was a good idea. I thought they were going to stretch to a one stop on the softs by going another 4 laps. It certainly seemed like they could. The offset will usually be inherently slower. In this case, I think it was Lando's driving and the car being good on the tyres which got us more laps at the end of the stints before the tyres plateaued to run at smaller but quicker delta to those around us.

One thing I did not consider in the race was how strong of an effect the dirty air was having on the tyre temps, and I think this is what brought us the time and made it work. The Delta helped us get past people. More people than if we'd pitted earlier. But it ensured we'd get past them and into clean air, where the tyre temps would be lower and the car pushed to go faster whilst still managing the tyres.

I knew the dirty air was affecting us, but I thought it was from an aero point of view because I've seen this car struggle all season in dirty air. I still think the aero struggles a little more in dirty air than we'd like (outside of tyre temperatures), but predominantly the gift in this race was tyre temps as once again... this race was all about the tyres.
Yes, something like that. When Will, Lando's engineer, started talking about an undercut, I thought it would be a good idea, but by talking about it they provoked Mercedes to do a defensive undercut, thus opening up a straight space for Lando to drive at his real pace.

And then I thought, what if they hold off and do a longer first stint, because that would be good towards the end of the race. And the team executed it perfectly. Knowing that Lando is a master at saving his tyres, the plan was perfect. At this point Lando was even catching Max, which meant that their pace was not inferior to Red Bull.

The cars here are usually set up for high downforce, which means it's harder to follow the car in the corners. The tires overheat, the engine overheats too. I remember before that a clean overtake requires 1.5 seconds of advantage. This is possible when the tires are fresher. In the corners, Lando caught up with his rivals, got closer to them, and on the straight he overtook them using the DRS. If the tires had as much life as the rivals in front, Lando would simply lag behind in the corners, then only compensate for this lag on the straights. It turns out to be the status quo, when there is no advantage in speed.

Given that the overall pace of the Ferrari and Mercedes is comparable to the McLaren, it is clear that this advantage has to come from somewhere. So I was glad when Lando said that he wanted to catch Max, and not just defend against George. That was the grown-up thing to do. And even though Lando didn't win and I was disappointed, the team did everything right. The strategists did a masterful job this time, and Lando did a great job behind the wheel.

The consistent fight for victories in itself only hardens the spirit at McLaren. They get used to the pressure, and therefore it will be easier from now on. Red Bull feels threatened by McLaren and there is plenty of evidence to back this up. Now their rivals have acknowledged it. Let the Bulls feel the pressure now and then they might start making mistakes.

And also about the extension of stints. It reminded me a bit of Barcelona 2021, when Lewis had fresher tires in front of Max at the end of the race and was able to beat him in the race. I expected about the same.

Mcl_G10
Mcl_G10
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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I think I've read a fair few bits of criticism towards lando and mclaren for not being able to win more races where the car looks the fastest. I think this is very unfair imo. In redbull we have a formidable driver and team both in an operational sense and outright talent. To overcome this it takes a little time, the feeling or being equal and/or superior grows, the fear lessens and slowly but surely the redbull machine begins to look less and less formidable as the races pass. Norris is there, right there and he knows he is so close to breaking the unbreakable. Full confidence in the machine underneath him. Just as stella said before about giving him "the right materials". He has that now and he knows it.
The drivers championship challenge is unlikely this year but still possible. A 2 or 3 race sequence of wins along with part penalties for max is all it takes. If we couple this with the huge success rate of upgrades for mcl we could end up winning a fair few races at the end of the season if others can't match us.
Austria should be interesting. I think lando will qualify p1 for sprint, the race along with winning both. That would be the perfect weekend and also the psychological blow the mclaren have been waiting to deal rb.
But we will need more, we need Oscar right behind him and I think Mercedes will be close too especially in qualy.

Let's go!!!

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Darth-Piekus
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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Lando needs to win in the next few races. Neighsayers have started to spew bs again. Bs like he needs a much faster car to beat Max on merit etc etc

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SilviuAgo
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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For the moment we are in Ljubljana and the weather is perfect, but some forecast for the weekend is not looking good. Some rain in PM for Saturday and rain around 2-3 PM for Sunday. So I hope the race result not to be impacted by the weather. I think that in McL position and race pace, a dry track will be more suitable than a wet one. What is you opinion?

Emag
Emag
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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I am currently staying in upper Austria and the weather is really nice, but the weekend is forecast for some rain.

Macklaren
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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SilviuAgo wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 17:49
For the moment we are in Ljubljana and the weather is perfect, but some forecast for the weekend is not looking good. Some rain in PM for Saturday and rain around 2-3 PM for Sunday. So I hope the race result not to be impacted by the weather. I think that in McL position and race pace, a dry track will be more suitable than a wet one. What is you opinion?
I don't see why McLaren would suffer in the rain. Both Lando and Oscar are very good in the rain. Perhaps makes it a little more of a lottery for everyone. And maybe gives Red Bull a bit of an easier time on the kerbs

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organic
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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Macklaren wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 18:52
SilviuAgo wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 17:49
For the moment we are in Ljubljana and the weather is perfect, but some forecast for the weekend is not looking good. Some rain in PM for Saturday and rain around 2-3 PM for Sunday. So I hope the race result not to be impacted by the weather. I think that in McL position and race pace, a dry track will be more suitable than a wet one. What is you opinion?
I don't see why McLaren would suffer in the rain. Both Lando and Oscar are very good in the rain. Perhaps makes it a little more of a lottery for everyone. And maybe gives Red Bull a bit of an easier time on the kerbs
As we saw in Canada from george's race and lando's with the SC it's just way more of a lottery. If you have the dry pace then wet just can make things complicated

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SilviuAgo
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Re: 2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

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Emag wrote:
25 Jun 2024, 18:00
I am currently staying in upper Austria and the weather is really nice, but the weekend is forecast for some rain.
Yup, weather in Styria always was strange :) I remember couple a years ago being for FRECA races at RedBull Ring and over an hour we had plenty of sun, heavy rain, sun with clouds, light rain, hot sun....a real chaos due to the natural place of the track. You never know what is coming from behind the hills :?