2024 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, June 28 - 30

[Rodak]

Just a couple of points:

1) It's BRAKES and BRAKING, not 'breaking'. Although they did break in the end.

2) Verstappen did not invent late braking, there have always been late brakers and 'dive bombs'.

[venkyhere]

Watched the race deferred live, hence late.

Cars :

- RB20 final set up post-sprint, was faster in every corner/straight, but with no tyre life. Were Marko/Horner bluffing when they commented it was a setup change for 'race pace' ? Tyres were not even lasting the standard Pirelli-defined stint length.

- MCL38 is the absolute king of tyre life in 2024. Drop in pace towards the end of any Pirelli-defined stint length is very very less. I will go out on a limb and say that they can run races with 1 less pitstop, no need to follow the norm.

- W15 clearly the third fastest car, it's conclusive that Mercedes has leapfrogged Ferrari.

- SF-24 has sank. Unless they have some magic bullet within the Silverstone upgrades, they can count finishing higher than P7 for the rest of the season, down to luck.



Drivers :

NOR vs VER :

- as I suspected y'day, RBR going with 1M and 2H tyres was a gamble that either makes a 20s+ victory margin or barely manages to finish on the podium. The latter happened. In fact, the pitstop delay and losing the 7-8s 'buffer was down to the pressure felt by the team, from poor H tyre life and not having any fresh M for final stint.

- there is no excuse in the world that can justify VER's defense in turns 1,3,4. Members here who are trying to do so, kindly stop. You know the truth. We saw the 17yr old Max back again. This reminds me of footballer Zidane, who used to have episodes of volcanic fuse-blows without warning. People who are amazing with soaking up pressure, when the limit breaches, it can be a terrible release of rage. Gifted genius with a flawed EQ (typically a by product of bad childhood experiences)

- NOR has to hone his racecraft more. Has to realize that the fight for P1 can be far tougher than the fight for P3 or lower places. He made many attempts, but was not decisive. Yes, VER was moving under braking to block, but after 1 or 2 times, NOR should start to anticipate it better and be more decisive. But he is the guy who kept it clean in the dogfight, it wasn't as if NOR forced a collision.

PIA :

- track limits error from quali has cost him the win today. Mighty lesson on how little things can cause huge swings

RUS & SAI :

- kept their noses clean, drove a lonely race by sticking to what the car could do and not overdriving it, and got rewarded with win & podium.

[renault rs26]

In the meantime on F1's instagram page:
'Leclerc is closing in on Norris in second place '
even though Leclerc score 0.

[Dunlay]

Just a couple of points:

1) It's BRAKES and BRAKING, not 'breaking'. Although they did break in the end.

2) Verstappen did not invent late braking, there have always been late brakers and 'dive bombs'.

It's not "Late Braking", it's "Moving under Braking". Drivers respected that rule and didn't move under braking before the advent of Max Verstappen.

[RonMexico]

This is Verstappens mentality in a nutshell, and no one elses.

I would say every great champion has that mentality.

Nope. Great champions are sporting and do not cheat. Plenty of examples out there. It’s just in F1 that this was invented by some fans to protect their cheating favourite driver. Started with Schumacher, continues with Verstappen.

Champions cheat and abuse rules all the time in just about every sport lmao. F1 is angelic compared to most other professional sports

[AR3-GP]

Drivers :

NOR vs VER :
- there is no excuse in the world that can justify VER's defense in turns 1,3,4. Members here who are trying to do so, kindly stop. You know the truth. We saw the 17yr old Max back again. This reminds me of footballer Zidane, who used to have episodes of volcanic fuse-blows without warning. People who are amazing with soaking up pressure, when the limit breaches, it can be a terrible release of rage. Gifted genius with a flawed EQ (typically a by product of bad childhood experiences)

- NOR has to hone his racecraft more. Has to realize that the fight for P1 can be far tougher than the fight for P3 or lower places. He made many attempts, but was not decisive. Yes, VER was moving under braking to block, but after 1 or 2 times, NOR should start to anticipate it better and be more decisive. But he is the guy who kept it clean in the dogfight, it wasn't as if NOR forced a collision.

Championships aren't won by being afraid to offend the sensibilities of an audience with your driving. That applies to both drivers.

I actually thought it was hard racing by both, and the stewards did a decent job to let them settle it after both executed their grey area maneuvers. They contacted in a hard fight and it happens. Penalties were issued. We cannot change anything. It's racing.

No amount of criticism towards either driver is going to take away their talents as much as some would hope that is the case...We will have to witness their talents over and over again for the next decade most likely. Today won't change that. One may choose to insult them now, but it's meaningless. The same drivers will show up and rise and fall by their talents next weekend.

[Shal_Leg16]

This one for those who kept on saying ohh max has improved max has matured blah …blah…blah. Guess it was only till nobody was catching him.

This one is for those who complained race is boring.

Not that im complaining

[variante]

- W15 clearly the third fastest car, it's conclusive that Mercedes has leapfrogged Ferrari.

- SF-24 has sank. Unless they have some magic bullet within the Silverstone upgrades, they can count finishing higher than P7 for the rest of the season, down to luck.

Is it that clear...?
Ferrari's 2nd driver (Sainz) finished well ahead of Mercedes' 2nd driver (Hamilton), and just 4.5 seconds shy of Mercedes' 1st driver (Russel). Same ranking as in qualifying.
Leclerc is a bit of a messy driver, but he normally has an edge over Sainz.
So, if anything, there is ground to say that Ferrari is still faster than Mercedes.

But yeah, the Ferraris should've been battling for the 1st place, not for the 3rd-4th...

[Dunlay]

These guys were quick.

[AR3-GP]

- W15 clearly the third fastest car, it's conclusive that Mercedes has leapfrogged Ferrari.

- SF-24 has sank. Unless they have some magic bullet within the Silverstone upgrades, they can count finishing higher than P7 for the rest of the season, down to luck.

Is it that clear...?
Ferrari's 2nd driver (Sainz) finished well ahead of Mercedes' 2nd driver (Hamilton), and just 4.5 seconds shy of Mercedes' 1st driver (Russel). Same ranking as in qualifying.
Leclerc is a bit of a messy driver, but he normally has an edge over Sainz.
So, if anything, there is ground to say that Ferrari is still faster than Mercedes.

But yeah, the Ferraris should've been battling for the 1st place, not for the 3rd-4th...

Hamilton had 2 tenths floor damage. Slightly their own fault given the different setup on Hamilton's car but perhaps the car needed to be configured more like Russell's car and one would observe the same performance.

[PapayaFan481]

For anyone wondering, Lando didn't correctly serve his penalty in the pits. However, it was applied at the end of the race by the stewards because he still was a classified finisher so he won't get any penalty for Silverstone. Guess Perez didn't do this as his retirement was much earlier into the Japan GP.
https://x.com/jeppe_olesen/status/18074 ... RPWRQ&s=19

Really? That was stupid of them then given that, initially, they were repairing the car (new nose and tyres) so clearly intended to rejoin the race until (according to Sky Sports) Lando said to retire the car. Probably best they did retire then or they'd have gotten another penalty for not serving the first one correctly!!

[chrisc90]

What part of the first penalty did they not serve properly?

[Dunlay]

From the archives!

[Mogster]

It’s not the dive bomb per se that’s the problem, it’s the fact that drivers (mostly Verstappen) are not attempting to take the standard line after touching the apex. They’re carrying on straight almost, running their rival off the circuit. It makes you almost impossible to overtake, or to defend against. The same goes for the weaving in the braking zone.

Indycar have a rule that you can’t change your line to react to the position of a following car. The defender has to pick a line then stick to it. Maybe this needs implementing in F1. It would stop this stupidity.

[AR3-GP]

From the archives!

There's a subtlety here in my opinion. There's moving under breaking where the overtaking driver is behind, chooses a line, and then you block (like Baku 2018), and then there is defending driver choosing a line, waiting for overtaker to pull alongside, and then crowding him while leaving space to the outside.

Once two drivers are alongside one another, I don't see any reason why either driver would not be allowed to "close the space" between the two of them (i.e crowd but leaving space). That's actually something that Verstappen has done not just in Monza, but all of his career and why he'd difficult to overtake. Crowding is a tactical grey area. It makes it harder for the overtaker, without being a reckless like Baku 2018.


Verstappen did the same thing on the final lap of Abu Dhabi in 2021 entering the brake zone of the back straight. There was no penalty because there was no contact. Hamilton had a run on the outside, and it was a lot harder for Hamilton because Verstappen widened the entry to his own corner to the maximum extent, while still allowing Hamilton room on the track.



The penalties in both cases (Monza, and Austria) should be due to the contact. Another example is Hamilton hitting Piastri last year in Monza:



The penalty is for the contact. "moving under braking" isn't really the issue. He's crowding (which is racecraft that I think belongs in racing), but leading to contact (which should not happen and reasonably deserves a penalty).