2024 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, June 28 - 30

[Dunlay]

From the archives!

[Mogster]

It’s not the dive bomb per se that’s the problem, it’s the fact that drivers (mostly Verstappen) are not attempting to take the standard line after touching the apex. They’re carrying on straight almost, running their rival off the circuit. It makes you almost impossible to overtake, or to defend against. The same goes for the weaving in the braking zone.

Indycar have a rule that you can’t change your line to react to the position of a following car. The defender has to pick a line then stick to it. Maybe this needs implementing in F1. It would stop this stupidity.

[AR3-GP]

From the archives!

There's a subtlety here in my opinion. There's moving under breaking where the overtaking driver is behind, chooses a line, and then you block (like Baku 2018), and then there is defending driver choosing a line, waiting for overtaker to pull alongside, and then crowding him while leaving space to the outside.

Once two drivers are alongside one another, I don't see any reason why either driver would not be allowed to "close the space" between the two of them (i.e crowd but leaving space). That's actually something that Verstappen has done not just in Monza, but all of his career and why he'd difficult to overtake. Crowding is a tactical grey area. It makes it harder for the overtaker, without being a reckless like Baku 2018.


Verstappen did the same thing on the final lap of Abu Dhabi in 2021 entering the brake zone of the back straight. There was no penalty because there was no contact. Hamilton had a run on the outside, and it was a lot harder for Hamilton because Verstappen widened the entry to his own corner to the maximum extent, while still allowing Hamilton room on the track.



The penalties in both cases (Monza, and Austria) should be due to the contact. Another example is Hamilton hitting Piastri last year in Monza:



The penalty is for the contact. "moving under braking" isn't really the issue. He's crowding (which is racecraft that I think belongs in racing), but leading to contact (which should not happen and reasonably deserves a penalty).

[Sergej]

I feel sorry for Norris who took zero points for a contact in which Max was mostly at fault, but I still think he lacked some racecraft and was a bit naïf in the duel, why insisting on trying the overtake at T3 ? a couple of useless divebombs when he could use the run to T3 to cut the distance to Max, position the car for a perfect exit and overtake in the run to T4...also in the fatal contact, why put yourself on the outside in a position where there's nothing to gain ? he had car, tyres and DRS advantage but he never seemed to "architect" the overtake smartly, I think Leclerc in 2022 was better in doing this (3 times), anyway he surely will learn from today and this will make him a better driver

sad that a friendship which seemed genuine may have come to an end today, but that's how it goes when you race at these levels I guess.

[AR3-GP]

I feel sorry for Norris who took zero points for a contact in which Max was mostly at fault, but I still think he lacked some racecraft and was a bit naïf in the duel, why insisting on trying the overtake at T3 ? a couple of useless divebombs when he could use the run to T3 to cut the distance to Max, position the car for a perfect exit and overtake in the run to T4...also in the fatal contact, why put yourself on the outside in a position where there's nothing to gain ? he had car, tyres and DRS advantage but he never seemed to "architect" the overtake smartly, I think Leclerc in 2022 was better in doing this (3 times), anyway he surely will learn from today and this will make him a better driver

I think the Norris overtaking place made sense. It's the same problem that Verstappen faced in Bahrain 2022. The run to T4 (same corner as Bahrain) wasn't long enough. The other car had superior traction and engine power/straightline speed in like for like conditions.

Norris needed make Verstappen stumble into T3 but he probably should claimed the inside line into T3 but stayed behind to get the DRS for T4 as Verstappen did last year against the Ferraris. Remember that Verstappen needed this, and Perez couldn't clear Sainz on the run to T4 because the Ferraris were so quick on the straights until Bird told Perez to copy Verstappen's technique of claiming the inside line, but staying just behind, to ruin the exit of leading car and then have DRS to T4).

[zibby43]

- W15 clearly the third fastest car, it's conclusive that Mercedes has leapfrogged Ferrari.

- SF-24 has sank. Unless they have some magic bullet within the Silverstone upgrades, they can count finishing higher than P7 for the rest of the season, down to luck.

Is it that clear...?
Ferrari's 2nd driver (Sainz) finished well ahead of Mercedes' 2nd driver (Hamilton), and just 4.5 seconds shy of Mercedes' 1st driver (Russel). Same ranking as in qualifying.
Leclerc is a bit of a messy driver, but he normally has an edge over Sainz.
So, if anything, there is ground to say that Ferrari is still faster than Mercedes.

But yeah, the Ferraris should've been battling for the 1st place, not for the 3rd-4th...

Hamilton had floor damage. If he didn’t give that place back to Sainz at the beginning, it would’ve been a P2 finish or better.

[selvam_e2002]

I feel sorry for Norris who took zero points for a contact in which Max was mostly at fault, but I still think he lacked some racecraft and was a bit naïf in the duel, why insisting on trying the overtake at T3 ? a couple of useless divebombs when he could use the run to T3 to cut the distance to Max, position the car for a perfect exit and overtake in the run to T4...also in the fatal contact, why put yourself on the outside in a position where there's nothing to gain ? he had car, tyres and DRS advantage but he never seemed to "architect" the overtake smartly, I think Leclerc in 2022 was better in doing this (3 times), anyway he surely will learn from today and this will make him a better driver

sad that a friendship which seemed genuine may have come to an end today, but that's how it goes when you race at these levels I guess.

It is difficult to have race craft when you are racing with Max. He even park his car top of another car. So the only solution would be, whoever race with Max need better car i.e faster than him so that Max cannot give any trouble.

Max is very poor in Wheel to wheel racing like Vettel.

As Alonso said long way back about Vettel that " we know his true capability if he drove for moderate car" same goes to Max as well. We will know his true potential once he come out from his comfortable zone i.e RB.

[renault rs26]

From the archives!

On drivers initiative they upgraded penalties to be harsher this season. So 5s became 10s.

[cliffgamerz]

From the archives!

On drivers initiative they upgraded penalties to be harsher this season. So 5s became 10s.

In this case it was much more than a simple wheel banging and Lando DNF'd hence the harsher penalty, but was it a justified penalty? who knows.

[AR3-GP]

After Norris overtook Verstappen in the run off on lap 59, he didn't drop back sufficiently to prove that he didn't gain a lasting advantage. He led all the way into T4, then let Verstappen by but crucially it allowed him to be even closer for the DRS detection point on the next lap. I don't see how the stewards accounted for this? It's similar to a Spa race many years ago. You can still have a lasting advantage even if you "give the place back" especially when the drivers are competing to stay within the DRS window.

[SKYnRacing24]

The dynamic between Lando and Max is fascinating. Buddys who have turned to Rivals these last few Grand Prix's. I still remember Lewis after monaco in 2014 " Were not friends " after all the antics on and off track. I don't think its quite at that point, behind the scenes they have probably talked but the media will push this stuff hard.

On Lando. My opinion if he can really make a title winning campaign is making me lean into the " No " camp. Last 4 outings he should of capitalised on at LEAST one of them. The fact he didn't should start raising questions, yes its a small sample size but he's not making the most of this race winning pace of the mclaren. Lando is a great driver but Max is a elite one

Silverstone will be fascinating as i feel the cars will be matched there and Mercedes looking to capitalise again.

[search]

RB20 final set up post-sprint, was faster in every corner/straight, but with no tyre life. Were Marko/Horner bluffing when they commented it was a setup change for 'race pace' ? Tyres were not even lasting the standard Pirelli-defined stint length.

going by their tire choice, I would think the car was set up for a race mainly on hards. They probably didn't expect to need much tire saving on that tire, which would also explain why they fired off good in qualifying.

[Edax]

“Braking” doesn’t mean pushing the pedal really! It means you’re in the braking zone…

If he was in the braking zone and he wasn't braking, he wouldn't be making the corner..... It's called the braking zone because that's where drivers needs to brake to make a corner......

The correction left was made before the braking zone.

But you always steer in the braking zone, how would it otherwise be possible to take a corner. Max went to the left to achieve the best corner entry, something drivers do all the time. Only Norris was there and he should have seen that.

Agree. The corner also falls off slightly to the left. So it is easy to drift a bit, when you are concentrating on the apex. Of course 100% on Verstappen, but I don’t see anything malicious.

Norris and Verstappen have been pushing the limits during the past few races so it was bound to happen at some point with either of them.

In anyway Norris can now return the favor by giving Verstappen a mirror for his birthday.

[stephen]

The race was entertaining but the post race fan wars on social media is even more entertaining.

[TwanV]

Is it max though? His line was perfectly straight. I'm sure the rulebook will be analyzed till kingdom come but to be sure, what was Lando doing there under braking with serious overspeed? driving headful into a squeezed gap and failing to avoid contact using the kerbs on the outside. Clumsy, and with 4 track limit violations after having had the black and white shows to me he lost his nerve at least to a degree. he could have handled that better but wanted to force the issue knowing he'd get penalized.