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I mean, one thing doesn't exclude the other imho, strategy was wrong and Max was a step too far with all those rants over the radio; a bad day at the office for everyone, let's thank McLaren dumbness for handing us 7 points and move on to Spa, hoping they all will learn from today.
It would have been better if he was able to keep his cool more, but we known that he needs to express himself. You will not change him.
The thing is that we need to understand that he is currently trying to salvage a WDC with a far inferior car, which evolve negatively, that he is the only driver bringing home points and good places with this car. He does not need any handicap with a bad strategy when the car has such a low level of performance.
I mean, one thing doesn't esclude the other imho, strategy was wrong and Max was a step too far with all those rants over the radio; a bad day at the office for everyone, let's thank McLaren dumbness for handing us 7 points and move on to Spa, hoping they all will learn from today.
I don't think the strat was wrong. Overall, Red Bull did not have the pace for Mclaren, but with this extended stint strategy they could have lucked into a VSC or SC pitstop that handed them track position and/or the win. At worst P3.
If Max completed the move on Hamilton around lap 35, things would have gone well. The ones on lap 62/63 were not helped by Hamilton pushing him off in T4 and then moving in T1 a lap later, but one of them should have stuck, preferably the earlier one after Hamilton locked up in T1 and rolled the carpet out.
These races are decided by fine margins. In Spain he made a decisive move on the 2nd lap that won him the race. Here in Hungary he missed that decisive move early on with Hamilton and it cost him a much better race. That doesn't happen often, so I'm not too bothered. Look at the other drivers this weekend. Russell should have outqualified Hamilton which would have hindered Hamilton's race. Leclerc would have been on the podium if he didn't make a mess of Friday and Saturday. Norris loses another position at the start of a race which cost him the win, again. Those drivers have more recurring problems.
Onward to Spa. The car was good in the highest speed corners here in Hungary. Let's see if that carries over to Spa. It has been one of Red Bull and Max's best circuits in the ground effects era.
Last edited by AR3-GP on 21 Jul 2024, 21:35, edited 3 times in total.
that camera shot on Hannah was quite telling about the strategy today
Did we finally got the answer on what were they trying toa chieve with this retarded strategy?
I mean, letting Max being undercuted twice by Hamilton and once by Leclerc on one of the most difficult track regarding to overtaking was one of the biggest mistake they could make on strategy.
The car wasn't fast enough and when the McLaren started 1-2 and after giving back the position, the only place they could achieve was third, and they blew it with the dumbest strategy possible.
Hannah and the team let Max down this time. His anger was justified.
Traditionally, Hungary is a circuit where a tyre advantage is more exaggerated at this track because of the deg. Especially in the middle sector. Its funny for this race? Despite the temperatures the newer tyre never gave that big advantage it had in recent years.
But what was the plan? Obviously, the McLaren were out of reach.
The tyre advantage was needed for what, to battle who? Obviously, Max did not need a tyre advantage to fight off Hamilton and Leclerc, not on this track.
The strategy was entirely flawed. They wanted to gain a tyre advantage to overtake people who would have been behind Max with a normal strategy.
There was nothing to gain, but everything to lose.
As AR3-GP said, strategy may look bad in hindsight but it did give him maximum opportunity to win this race. SC or VSC after McLaren pits gives the victory to Verstappen. Or if the tyres fall off a cliff. VER even with losing track position was still on track to get P3. Not sure if VER wad surprised they had to do such a gambling strategy or what but any fan of a less successful team is well aware of such strategies.
As AR3-GP said, strategy may look bad in hindsight but it did give him maximum opportunity to win this race. SC or VSC after McLaren pits gives the victory to Verstappen. Or if the tyres fall off a cliff. VER even with losing track position was still on track to get P3. Not sure if VER wad surprised they had to do such a gambling strategy or what but any fan of a less successful team is well aware of such strategies.
Hell, Norris won in Miami because of it.
You don't win championship by betting on a lucky safety car. This isn't a valid strategy. The time loss was so big that even a SC wouldn't have saved their race and would not have achieved anything better than third.
They risked Max guaranteed third place for nothing. And now they lost points and left their driver furious.
The team is in shambles. David Couthard literally says "Hamilton was definitely optimistic with the turn in" And yet Max's pit wall doesn't back him up at all.
To me it's clear that Red Bull went the wrong way with the suspension changes for this season (more extreme, more a-arm inclination) and it's the root cause of the tire overheating and inability to ride curbs. They are trying to compensate with aero but this isn't the real solution to the problem.
We will get our confirmation with the RB21 but they know the suspension of the RB20 has not worked and that the suspension of the RB19 still whispers to the tires in the hands of the VCARB team.
RB19 might be the fastest race car even now if just run at this point.
The team is in shambles. David Couthard literally says "Hamilton was definitely optimistic with the turn in" And yet Max's pit wall doesn't back him up at all.
Coulthard? He's hardly an unbiased observer.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.
in my opinion, that kind of "retarded" strategy could work in a track where it's easy to overtake and you can take big advantage of fresher tyres, but Budapest is not the case, here track position is king, we all saw how Max struggled for passing Charles even though he was coming with a much better pace
I think there was no point in committing to that strategy, there was all to lose with Hamilton and nothing to gain against the McLarens, you never would have passed them with a few lap tyre offset
on the other hand, it's true that 3rd place was still on the table, had Max kept it cool with Hamilton, the overtake seemed doable in the end
that's why I say today there were multiple mistakes from all sides
The team is in shambles. David Couthard literally says "Hamilton was definitely optimistic with the turn in" And yet Max's pit wall doesn't back him up at all.
The team backed him up completely even when they made themselves look like idiots in doing so in the aftermath of the Austrian GP.
In this race the team struggled with strategy which rarely ever happens (he usually benefits from their superior operational qualities) and made a mistake of their own and Max trashed them like they meant nothing to him in front of the whole world .
He is not a boy anymore.
He is a grown man and should be expected to dis0lay the behaviours of a grown man.
Hearing the words "He just wanted to win", while making excuses for witnessing a tantrum is something you expect to hear when talking about a toddler or young child who doesn't understand the concept of not being able to win everything.
It would even be understandable if it was just every now and then, but it's literally every single time he does not get his way.
I don't know any other driver who has to put some whining excuse on the radio almost literally every single time he gets overtaken by another driver or has even a just below optimal performance.
Max is WELL past the stage of doing the grown up version of kicking and screaming and wrecking things in a supermarket and expecting the response to be a cuddle and a "there there, quiet now" from someone expected to "coach" and put up with his behaviours.
It's sad and it's embarrassing to see/hear. That's what you saw conveyed by his pit wall today.
A group of people who since he joined have literally done everything they can including selling their souls to defend his indefensible behaviours many many many times over, just to get him winning and keep him winning, only for him to berate them like some spoiled Prince yelling at a lowly servant the very moment he has to dig deep and show some class.
That's the kind of thing he needs to hear to grow into his best self as a man, not coddling and excuse making.
/rant
Last edited by GrizzleBoy on 21 Jul 2024, 22:43, edited 1 time in total.
I don’t know how you can speak so badly of your team after just one bad race!
After all it was you yourself making the mistakes! Going wide after passing Hamilton the first time was an amateur error…
Yeah he got undercut twice yet he clearly had the pace to overtake the cars ahead! But he didn’t!
Just accept it was an off weekend for you and that’s all! This team gave you 19/22 wins last year…
How many overtake were done today? Not many. It was very hard to overtake even with a pace advantage. Especially someone like Hamilton who will push you out or turn into you.
This track is known to be a Monaco 2 for overtaking. The strategy was bad and Verstappen was furious that twice they made the same mistake that cost him the third place.
Overall he sees the car dropping completely, the performance being lost, the setup being wrong, the balance of the car worsening, the updates not working at all or going backwards....
And now you add a stupid strategy. He feels like he is doing miracles to keep the car on the podium, while Perez can't even score points most of times when during this time the team is performing worse and not giving his best or acknowledging that the situation is becoming worse every week.
Max Verstappen is a competitor living in the current championship. He will not accept the team becoming bad because it was once very good. It's a competition, you don't tolerate mediocrity when you want to win.
Well one thing is certain, Max can't behave like this in the remaining races (whatever the reasons), as it only leads to downfall. Perfectly illustrated by this entire weekend going from mediocre to bad to worse. Constructive criticism and self reflection are key now that races will be difficult. He's saying people who disagree with him can f**k off, but what exactly is his plan in the long term? Will he be having these outbursts every race from now on if the car is not there? Pointless.
I'm starting to believe him leaving RB is now a serious possibility, and almost a certainty if wdc would start to slip away in the latter stages of the season. If that happens RB are royally screwed, while Max going to merc I think is at best a sideways move for him. The best option by far currently still available for RB is Sainz, but that would still be a downgrade in nearly every area, except maybe hot headedness.
