2024 F1 season - General Discussion

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
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Big Tea
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Joined: 24 Dec 2017, 20:57

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Vanja #66 wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:49
Luscion wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:41
2025 prototype tyres and new C6 compound will be tested at the Mexico GP
Fantastic, can't believe the sport is actually making good moves overall for several years already :lol:
Are they not just arbitrary numbers? Renumbering the tyres does nothing if they are a similar compound, and if they are why not just juggle the existing number if they say less options saves cost.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Luscion
Luscion
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Joined: 13 Feb 2023, 01:37

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Big Tea wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 17:11
Vanja #66 wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:49
Luscion wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:41
2025 prototype tyres and new C6 compound will be tested at the Mexico GP
Fantastic, can't believe the sport is actually making good moves overall for several years already :lol:
Are they not just arbitrary numbers? Renumbering the tyres does nothing if they are a similar compound, and if they are why not just juggle the existing number if they say less options saves cost.
Theyre different compounds for 2025, Pirelli is trying to reduce degradation so drivers can push but still allow for a mix of pit stop strats

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-a ... /10543651/
Last edited by Luscion on 08 Oct 2024, 17:51, edited 1 time in total.

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Vanja #66
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Joined: 19 Mar 2012, 16:38

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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AR3-GP wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 16:01
I don't think it's a good move. Pirelli's commitment to a C6 tire is a foreshadowing of the evolution of the sport away from traditional permanent circuits and towards mindless pop-up style street circuits.
There may be a connection, but I don't think it's detrimental. In any case, I'd prefer seeing as many 2-stop races as possible, and teams have the tyres to do 1-stop almost everywhere for years...

Big Tea wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 17:11
Are they not just arbitrary numbers? Renumbering the tyres does nothing if they are a similar compound, and if they are why not just juggle the existing number if they say less options saves cost.
C6 would be a new compound and, speaking relatively, should be the softest one for years. It was much needed on various tracks already this year
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Vanja #66 wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 17:43
There may be a connection, but I don't think it's detrimental. In any case, I'd prefer seeing as many 2-stop races as possible, and teams have the tyres to do 1-stop almost everywhere for years...
Softening the tire range doesn't lead to happy races with more stops. It leads to bad races with tires that cannot be driven on. Tire behavior is not linear. It is not:
C6: 4 laps
C5: 8 laps
C4: 16 laps.

What actually happens is that if a tire cannot be run in its preferred temperature window, it is useless whether that is a soft tire which overheats after 3 laps, or it's a hard tire that has zero pace like Leclerc found in Hungary 2022.

How you make a tire "degrade" is not a trivial science. It's not as simple as just using a "softer compound". If a team can keep the tire in the correct temperature window, the tire will not degrade. This leads to unanticipated outcomes like some teams going longer on a softer tire than others can do on a harder tire.
Last edited by AR3-GP on 08 Oct 2024, 19:25, edited 4 times in total.
A lion must kill its prey.

boiler
boiler
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Joined: 26 Jan 2014, 20:24

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Big Tea wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 17:11
Vanja #66 wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:49
Luscion wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:41
2025 prototype tyres and new C6 compound will be tested at the Mexico GP
Fantastic, can't believe the sport is actually making good moves overall for several years already :lol:
Are they not just arbitrary numbers? Renumbering the tyres does nothing if they are a similar compound, and if they are why not just juggle the existing number if they say less options saves cost.
I find it interesting Indycar has different compounds of tires and none of them have names except the primary and alternate red sidewalls because 99% of the people watching simply don't care.... Outside of the people on this forum who cares what the compounds are. Soft and hard are what they need.....

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Vanja #66
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Joined: 19 Mar 2012, 16:38

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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AR3-GP wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 18:59
Softening the tire range doesn't lead to happy races with more stops. It leads to bad races with tires that cannot be driven on. Tire behavior is not linear. It is not:
C6: 4 laps
C5: 8 laps
C4: 16 laps.

What actually happens is that if a tire cannot be run in its preferred temperature window, it is useless whether that is a soft tire which overheats after 3 laps, or it's a hard tire that has zero pace like Leclerc found in Hungary 2022.

How you make a tire "degrade" is not a trivial science. It's not as simple as just using a "softer compound". If a team can keep the tire in the correct temperature window, the tire will not degrade. This leads to unanticipated outcomes like some teams going longer on a softer tire than others can do on a harder tire.
There's a lot of oversimplification here that leads to misjudged conclusion :) All compounds have too small working window, but teams are already used to it. Other than that, softer compounds have lower working window overall, meaning C6 would be even lower than C5, so probably something like 80-110°C

In Monaco, C6 is sorely needed to move C4 as Hard tyre instead of Medium. There's no way anyone would be able to do 77 laps on C4 in anything close to competitive pace. Piastri's C3s started going off at the end even with Lexlerc's granny snail pace... Singapore also needs softer compounds, not to mention Jeddah. Baku was on edge this year, Piastri slowed the pace down to defend on main straight.

As for degradation, thermal deg depends on working window, if you keep them too hot they drop out. Too cold and you have no grip and little wear, but then you might get graining etc. A short stint on Hards is a thing only when you can't heat them up, which is improved if C6 is used as Soft and C4 as Hard in any case. Mechanical wear is still a thing with Pirellis, just ask Russell. Softer tyres will wear out quicker, even if they are kept in perfect window and you don't push the too hard. So a new, softer, compound is just what we need
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

Dunlay
Dunlay
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Joined: 10 Mar 2024, 15:23

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Luscion wrote:
08 Oct 2024, 15:41
2025 prototype tyres and new C6 compound will be tested at the Mexico GP
Cool. Another compound that Pirelli would fail to understand in time. :lol:

DDopey
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Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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Not sure where I needed to post this. But I need this, will put up a gofundme page :


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Vanja #66
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Joined: 19 Mar 2012, 16:38

Re: 2024 F1 season - General Discussion

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F1 equals its record for most multiple grand prix winners in a season

https://www.racefans.net/2024/10/30/f1- ... -a-season/

It’s the first time in his career Sainz has won more than one race in a season. Five other drivers have already done the same this year, making this the first season since 1981 to feature six multiple winners.

That feat was never previously achieved before 1981. In order to break the record this year, George Russell needs to win one more race or any other non-winner needs to win twice.
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie