Does F1 need another tweak to overtaking rules?

[Rikhart]

Nah, scrap rules. Just fix the circuits, make them more like the olden days, you have track, and then you have grass or gravel. All the problems about this, and also track limits, they would all magically disappear.

[Andres125sx]

Nah, scrap rules. Just fix the circuits, make them more like the olden days, you have track, and then you have grass or gravel. All the problems about this, and also track limits, they would all magically disappear.

Indeed

Just need 2m of grass next to the curb, then asphalt is possible to prevent accidents and slow down cars wich lost control, but just 1,5-2m of grass next to the curb and this problem will instantly dissapear


Max deserved a penalty btw, it´s amazing how FIA do protect him

[TimW]

It was also on Norris. He did not make an attempt to stay on track, he simply blasted on a past Verstappen off track. The argument that you were forced off track becomes a lot weaker that way, and there was an obvious gain from going around Max.
So although I don't agree to the penalty, he made it very easy for the stewards to judge it this way. Norris simply did not play it in a smart way, and Verstappen did.

Edit: Although I don't feel the penalty was fair, I am still not sure if I disagree with it. If the stewards would have let it pass, that would have created an even bigger mess. If drivers are allowed to blast past if they run out of space, that sets the precedent for many more controversial, impossible to judge situations in the future.

[pantherxxx]

There should be no rules at all and gravel/walls everywhere. There's no such b@tching in Nascar or Indycar.

[basti313]

Max deserved a penalty btw, it´s amazing how FIA do protect him

Why? I did not see a good argument that is based on the current rules for this. Or are you taking about what he deserves and not the rules?

[fourmula1]

The current rule set is robbing us fans of good wheel to wheel battles. The current rule set promotes very committed, all or nothing, one and done overtakes where one driver must concede the corner, and is then compromised on exit far more than the other.

They must strictly enforce that drivers must leave space. That way both cars are compromised on exit, side by side, and we will see them battle through the next few corners if not more! We are being robbed of w2w racing!

In most series, once your front axle is in the peripheral view of the other driver you are considered along side and entitled to space. I think we may find that enforcing track limits is a necessity, and I don't have a problem with that.

Force these damn drivers to battle it out!

Or just stay out of it. No limits, no stewards, let them crash.

[fourmula1]

There should be no rules at all and gravel/walls everywhere. There's no such b@tching in Nascar or Indycar.

I'm at the point of agreeing with this. The only downside will be tactically if one car is able to build a points lead they can just crash their rivals out. Maybe with the new regs this wont be possible if teams are closer to one another and start the season with new tactics.

[PlatinumZealot]

To me the "being ahead at the apex" is what causes a lot of trouble. Drivers always try to be in front at the apex to claim the corner theirs, not regarding where the other car is then.

This ahead at the apex must go. If one car manages to go up the inside by a little bit the car on the outside needs to accomodate for it. The car on the inside however needs to make sure the outside car can stay on track. "All the time you have to leave the space". This is how racing works, you compromise the guy ahead to find a way by.

In the case of Lando and Max, Lando should not have been penalised as Max went off the road as well in a poor attempt at staying ahead at the apex.

In Austria the divebombs by Lando against Max should also be outlawed by this as he did not leave enough space on the outside of the track for the other car.

Leave one car's width before and up to the apex, given the attacking car is alongside might solve it.

[Andres125sx]

Max deserved a penalty btw, it´s amazing how FIA do protect him

Why? I did not see a good argument that is based on the current rules for this. Or are you taking about what he deserves and not the rules?

The rules allow pushing other drivers out of track to avoid a pass?

If it´s Max, there must be some exception in the rulebook, even if I can´t find it

[dialtone]

I just happened to see this today:




Ric: "Was that who I think it is?"
Radio: "Yep"
Ric: "F--- this all over"

But you know what? It was smart of Max to drive like an open lobby driver. FIA allowed that.

If you watch the video till 1:45s you can see Ric back in the box talking to HM, or someone like him, that is obviously justifying what happened as a racing incident to Ric. Too funny.

It's been 7 years and absolutely nothing has changed in his driving style and FIA has done NOTHING to fix this so yeah the overtaking rules need a decent overhaul that stops this low quality wheel to wheel driving and brings back some fighting and penalties for those that go beyond the line (figuratively and literally).

[Watto]

I just happened to see this today:




Ric: "Was that who I think it is?"
Radio: "Yep"
Ric: "F--- this all over"

But you know what? It was smart of Max to drive like an open lobby driver. FIA allowed that.

If you watch the video till 1:45s you can see Ric back in the box talking to HM, or someone like him, that is obviously justifying what happened as a racing incident to Ric. Too funny.

It's been 7 years and absolutely nothing has changed in his driving style and FIA has done NOTHING to fix this so yeah the overtaking rules need a decent overhaul that stops this low quality wheel to wheel driving and brings back some fighting and penalties for those that go beyond the line (figuratively and literally).

I do think the overtaking rules need some work. But I don't think thats a good example to use. That would be a clean cut penalty for Max today, black and white. Daniel was ahead of Max at the apex. Lando was behind by a decent enough margin - I do get it though that Max easing off the brakes to make sure he was - moreover I am far from convinced Max would be that blatant these days, I don't think there is a chance Max back then would have had the defense he had against Lando up until the incident.

[Andres125sx]

Why? I did not see a good argument that is based on the current rules for this. Or are you taking about what he deserves and not the rules?

The rules allow pushing other drivers out of track to avoid a pass?

If it´s Max, there must be some exception in the rulebook, even if I can´t find it

How many more posts are you going to make crying about Max Verstappen ? Let it go, mate. It's unhealthy.

One post showing my opinion, and a reply to someone making a question is too much for you? What do you think is the reason for discussion forums mate?


What is unhealthy is taking any coment against Max Verstappen, as a personal attack to you. Take it easy mate

[aMessageToCharlie]

The rules allow pushing other drivers out of track to avoid a pass?

If it´s Max, there must be some exception in the rulebook, even if I can´t find it

How many more posts are you going to make crying about Max Verstappen ? Let it go, mate. It's unhealthy.

One post showing my opinion, and a reply to someone making a question is too much for you? What do you think is the reason for discussion forums mate?


What is unhealthy is taking any coment against Max Verstappen, as a personal attack to you. Take it easy mate

It's the same passive aggressive sour grapes in every threat, not one comment lol hardly what I would call a discussion. Glad that you agree on taking it easy. Enjoy the race weekend.

[Francis Bacon]

It was also on Norris. He did not make an attempt to stay on track, he simply blasted on a past Verstappen off track. The argument that you were forced off track becomes a lot weaker that way, and there was an obvious gain from going around Max.
So although I don't agree to the penalty, he made it very easy for the stewards to judge it this way. Norris simply did not play it in a smart way, and Verstappen did.

Edit: Although I don't feel the penalty was fair, I am still not sure if I disagree with it. If the stewards would have let it pass, that would have created an even bigger mess. If drivers are allowed to blast past if they run out of space, that sets the precedent for many more controversial, impossible to judge situations in the future.

I disagree that Max was smart. The reality is that Max made a mistake. If he himself had stayed on-track, and forced Lando to back-off and fall behind, it would have been smart. But Max braked too late, went off, and forced Lando off as well.

I know what the rules are, and leaving aside what transpired after this, it shouldn't be the case that all a defending driver has to do is "oops!" brake too late, divebomb the corner and run their opponent off track. Drivers who do this should be penalized.

Its not hard racing, its BS.

[Tvetovnato]

This is all very easy. If the car on the outside is slightly ahead when the braking starts for the corner (the normal braking point for the corner), the driver on the inside has no right to drive the car on the outside off the track. If he does, give the place back.

If both cars are side by side when the normal braking point starts, the car on the inside has the right for the corner. The outside driver can then expect that he won’t be given any room should he try to complete the move.

If the driver on the outside brakes too late, he will penalize himself by going off track or go too deep into the corner.

This has never ever been a problem before, and is very easy to fix now. Just do it.