Ferrari F10

[PlatinumZealot]

Yea I agree, these hanging pictures are useless because there looks to be a marshall holding the front wing in every picture.

You need a direct side on shot with the vehicle hanging freely, then you know the CG is directly under the lifting point

tim

n smikle, too-

Really!!- You look at those pictures and you get no impression whatsoever about the weight distribution? Are you only comfortable when you have perfect information with no tolerance?

It's all about numbers. Doesn't mean anything if you don't quantify or at least qualitatively account for the necessary factors.

For Instance... If the tow hook was above the rear wing instead of the air-box; a driverless ferrari, a Mercedez a redBull and a mclaren are then hung by cables at the hooking point. You photograph all of them...... can you lay out the implicit information for this problem?

There are a lot of things you need to know before you can say one car has distribution here or there.

example:

If I want to find out the difference in weight distribution between these cars, this I would need to find out:

Is the tie strap allowing the car to swing freely?

How far ahead is the driver CoG from the hooking point and the weight of those drivers.

The level of fuel in the tank because The fuel will move when the tank is tilted, and then the location of the fuel cog. which you can't tell from outside.

Which plane are you going to use to intersect the vertical line that I draw?

Finally Most importantly what differences in distance of the Cog along the wheelbase is considered to be significant among the various cars? 5mm 2cm? I need to know what tolerance is acceptable for me to work form the photos before I just say all them are the same anyway.

You can even have things like wind blowing the cars when they are hoisted up.

[pegasus83]

Hi Guys,
I'm the owner of the pics of Alonso's Tests in Fiorano

I'm pleased to see you like them, and I want to link you to the post I wrote on my site, which contains other pics and the video

http://www.drivingpleasure.net/public/f ... n-la-f10b/

Bye!

(I'm italian, sorry for my english!)

Alex

[timbo]

Welcome to the F1T, pegasus83!

Can you please tell how many laps Alonso did free?

[Shaddock]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Then why didn't Alonso and Massa start on the second row? LH front wing was half falling off in those first few laps.

[pegasus83]

Welcome to the F1T, pegasus83!

Can you please tell how many laps Alonso did free?

He did 4 laps recorded by Ferrari (the first video on my site) with the helmet cam installed.

Then he did 3 laps for advertising purposes, behind a Fiat Scudo.

Then other 3 runs, 3/4 laps each one

[ringo]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Then why didn't Alonso and Massa start on the second row? LH front wing was half falling off in those first few laps.

Well Alonso didn't start on the first row becuase his quali lap was not really good. The car seemed eratic in q3 for some reason, if you look on Alonso lap you will see what i mean.
Also we have to realize Hamilton is a very fast driver, and is qualifies well at this track.
My assessment comes from the practice times, the 3 qualifying stages and the first couple laps before the accident. The car was going well, so well Alonso was told to ease off and follow the wounded Hamilton for a while, maybe until the stops.
I think Ferrari also have better sector 3 times than the Mclaren, sector 3 being very technical. Suggesting the F10 has improved slow speed characteristics with the new exhaust system.

[aral]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Then why didn't Alonso and Massa start on the second row? LH front wing was half falling off in those first few laps.

Dont forget, that single lap speed is totally different to the performance over a race distance. Some cars speed up towards the end of a race, others slow down.

[myurr]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Then why didn't Alonso and Massa start on the second row? LH front wing was half falling off in those first few laps.

Well Alonso didn't start on the first row becuase his quali lap was not really good. The car seemed eratic in q3 for some reason, if you look on Alonso lap you will see what i mean.
Also we have to realize Hamilton is a very fast driver, and is qualifies well at this track.
My assessment comes from the practice times, the 3 qualifying stages and the first couple laps before the accident. The car was going well, so well Alonso was told to ease off and follow the wounded Hamilton for a while, maybe until the stops.
I think Ferrari also have better sector 3 times than the Mclaren, sector 3 being very technical. Suggesting the F10 has improved slow speed characteristics with the new exhaust system.

Well it's hard to tell in the 1st stint as Hamilton was driving around a problem, his damaged wing giving him plenty of understeer according to his interview.

In the second stint Alonso said that the car was not very good on the hard tyres and he certainly failed to make much impression on the cars in front of him. So to say the car is faster than McLaren is a bit of a stretch.

They certainly took a step forward and have brought themselves back into contention for podiums, but I'd say the Red Bull and the McLaren were still faster and McLaren have their big upgrade to come at the next race. If that works as expected then that'll almost certainly leave Ferrari fighting for best of the rest behind those two teams.

[ringo]

I think ferarri need a new front wing to match the exhuast upgrade. One with more down-force.
The f10 seems to be dependent on under body down-force to balance the rear wing, more than it is on the front wing.

[mx_tifoso]

"Looking at the actual performance of the car over the weekend, I have to say the updates to the aero package and revised exhaust system resulted in the F10 making a good step forward, allowing us to fight for the front places. Now it is important to keep pushing on the development front all the way to the end of the season.

Are his hopes for season-long development realistic? Perhaps Ferrari will continue to update the care until the end but past the summer break I doubt they'll be doing anything major or significant.

IIRC, teams start to give the new car more priority after the half-way point.

[forty-two]

Welcome to the F1T, pegasus83!

Can you please tell how many laps Alonso did free?

He did 4 laps recorded by Ferrari (the first video on my site) with the helmet cam installed.

Then he did 3 laps for advertising purposes, behind a Fiat Scudo.

Then other 3 runs, 3/4 laps each one

This is interesting. That adds up to at least 16 laps of "Promotional" running.

Of those 16 (or so), let's say 3 laps behind the Scudo were probably very very slow, but would provide useful data on how much heat was being thrown out by the revised exhaust layout, and more importantly which areas would be affected by this heat.

The rest of the laps though (13 based on the above), were presumably reasonably quick, which would be very useful for evaluating the new updates on the car.

I don't think Ferrari are alone in holding these "Filming" days, but it does smack of circumventing the in-season testing ban rules.

[aral]

He did 4 laps recorded by Ferrari (the first video on my site) with the helmet cam installed.

Then he did 3 laps for advertising purposes, behind a Fiat Scudo.

Then other 3 runs, 3/4 laps each one

This is interesting. That adds up to at least 16 laps of "Promotional" running.

Of those 16 (or so), let's say 3 laps behind the Scudo were probably very very slow, but would provide useful data on how much heat was being thrown out by the revised exhaust layout, and more importantly which areas would be affected by this heat.

The rest of the laps though (13 based on the above), were presumably reasonably quick, which would be very useful for evaluating the new updates on the car.

I don't think Ferrari are alone in holding these "Filming" days, but it does smack of circumventing the in-season testing ban rules.

All the info on heat would have been capable of being collected, without the car even being on track! So there was little benefit in "faking" a filming day.

[forty-two]

If that were true, why would Ferrari have used so many temp-sensor strips during free practice in Valencia?

[PlatinumZealot]

I think they leave them on in valencia for completion. There is a saying that we had in science class (when I was in high school): Take at least six readings for any experiment that you do. Who knows there might be other factors that come into play in subsequent experiments.

[mx_tifoso]

...

I don't think Ferrari are alone in holding these "Filming" days, but it does smack of circumventing the in-season testing ban rules.

I agree, but did anyone in or outside F1 complain when Mercedes did it? A huge difference is how Ferrari went about it; making videos and publicizing the whole event as they usually do.