Talking to a turbo expert

[autogyro]

Dont forget to factor in the losses from the actuation system of the variator.

[WhiteBlue]

Dont forget to factor in the losses from the actuation system of the variator.

The losses are not bigger than the multiple mechanical to electrical conversions.

[autogyro]

Dont forget to factor in the losses from the actuation system of the variator.

The losses are not bigger than the multiple mechanical to electrical conversions.

I think you will find that a much lighter induction flywheel generator motor would be a better idea.
It is why the flybrid systems are being dropped in performance applications and applied only to industrial and instrumentation.

[WhiteBlue]

Dont forget to factor in the losses from the actuation system of the variator.

The losses are not bigger than the multiple mechanical to electrical conversions.

I think you will find that a much lighter induction flywheel generator motor would be a better idea.

A flywheel cannot generate 70 hp from exhaust gas.

[autogyro]

A combination flywheel generator charging batteries can,if you apply the current directly to an ESERU to provide powertrain input and to supply the 'primary' motive force, the excess during use can be taken care of by an induction flywheel motor/generator and any more into storage in batteries.
You would need far fewer batteries if the balance is made useing the ic engine to bring the power level up as needed. A change of concept perhaps to save fuel?

Dont forget, the exhaust blown diffuser has proven how easy it is with electronic control to de-couple the engine from the conventional powertrain operating method currently accepted as the norm.

[ACRO]

i think the electrical hybrid charging rises first in big industrial engines since here you have a relative steady load of the engine ( e.g running a generator ) and so a steady turbo rpm. further in such big applications the turbo is very big and runs at relative low rpms. a small car turbo reaches rpms in exess of 200000 and there seem to be no generator/inverter systems that can deal such rpms without gearing. at wikipedia i found here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_turbocharger

one company developing a small hybrid charger , but it currently seem to be only on a drawboard, the practical function is not fully confirmed.

it maybe a future for hybrid cars since you can recover electrical energy far beyond using just braking energy, very interesting.

[WhiteBlue]

AG, I don't understand your talk because I have no idea what you are talking about. A Torotrak turbo compounder would feed any excess power from the the exhaust gas turbine directly to the engine shaft without storage. It has the potential to ad 10-15% of the engine power from HERS. The only weight would come from a slightly bigger sized turbine and the Torotrak CVT. I fail to see what you can do with an ESERU. Perhaps you give us an engineering diagram of the system or you stop making reference to a system that nobody but yourself knows.



Everybody can understand with one quick view how the Torotrak turbo compounder works. Why can't you provide something similar if your patent is protected and you are serious about this box.

[autogyro]

A turbine driven electric generator/motor can supply electrical energy to a powertrain electric motor directly. It can also be used to illiminate turbo lag.

Toloroidal TVT systems are heavy and require energy to keep the toloroidal disks in drive contact, producing heat at high power levels.
All CVT and TVT systems suffer from this problem at anything other than very low power levels.
Controling over 70 or so hp coupled to the powertrain with a toloroidal link will result in unpredictable slip on the disks and a disconcerting feel to the throttle pedal as the power output varies.

[WhiteBlue]

According to Torotrak the weight will be comparable to what we calculate for an electric system and the two cavity system is well capable of handling the power at 90% efficiency.

[autogyro]

90% efficiency hmmmmm.
I do not believe that statement.

[WhiteBlue]

You can easily extrapolate it from these tables

[autogyro]

I cant see a figure for the energy input required to hold pressure on the disks and maintain drive through the friction fluid.
Strange that.

[WhiteBlue]

Why would that need energy? Can't they use springs or hydraulic pressure without flow?

[autogyro]

i think the electrical hybrid charging rises first in big industrial engines since here you have a relative steady load of the engine ( e.g running a generator ) and so a steady turbo rpm. further in such big applications the turbo is very big and runs at relative low rpms. a small car turbo reaches rpms in exess of 200000 and there seem to be no generator/inverter systems that can deal such rpms without gearing. at wikipedia i found here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_turbocharger

one company developing a small hybrid charger , but it currently seem to be only on a drawboard, the practical function is not fully confirmed.

it maybe a future for hybrid cars since you can recover electrical energy far beyond using just braking energy, very interesting.

Yes but an induction charged motor generator on the turbine shaft does not need any complex gearing or inverter, just an epicyclic reducer and maybe not even that.

[autogyro]

Why would that need energy? Can't they use springs or hydraulic pressure without flow?

Not for the direct power figures you require.
Heavy enough spring (non flow) actuation would in anycase increase torque loss the higher the torque transfered through the system.
So the actual efficiency has to be variable and cannot be quoted as one figure anyway.
Dont forget, all transmission systems have variable efficiency depending on the ratio of transfer and varying frictional losses.
With this toloroidal system frictional losses are much increased keeping the disks under pressure.