The Fanboy Yin Yang Thread

[flynfrog]

Sure you boy can handle a full wet race?
Vettel must have lost his nice bubble after that puncture.

I'm sure he will cry himself to sleep with all of his trophies and his world championship from this year.

[mnmracer]

Vettel's always been extremely quick in the wet. The only thing that troubles him a little (or the Red Bell, Webber doesn't seem to do well either) is in drying conditions, but in Canada and Hungary, when it was raining, Vettel was flying.

[beelsebob]

Vettel's always been extremely quick in the wet. The only thing that troubles him a little (or the Red Bell, Webber doesn't seem to do well either) is in drying conditions, but in Canada and Hungary, when it was raining, Vettel was flying.

When it was really really wet in Hungary Hamilton crawled all over him, and then he made a mistake. When it was wet in canada, Button was regularly putting in faster laps than him, and when it was drying he ofc made his fatal mistake. Sorry, but I've not seen any evidence that Vettel is quick in the wet.

As far as I'm concerned in the wet:
• Hamilton improves relative to the rest of the field by quite a lot.
• Button improves a little.
• Alonso improves a little.
• Vettel remains fairly static.
• Massa gets a lot worse.

When it's drying:
• Button improves a lot.
• Hamilton improves a little.
• Alonso improves a little.
• Massa and Vettel get significantly worse.

[raymondu999]

When it was wet in canada, Button was regularly putting in faster laps than him, and when it was drying he ofc made his fatal mistake.

The second part is undeniable; but Button was stronger than Vettel in the phase where the conditions were for intermediates; and slicks. On the first half with full wets Button wasn't faster than Vettel.

Personally I think Vettel is very good in full wet conditions. In a weird fashion; he seems to be better in the wet (relatively) than he is in the damp. Button seems to be strongest in the damp (as opposed to full wet or full dry) for some weird reason.

By damp I mean; as I said above, intermediate-tyre conditions.

The McLaren this year seems to be very strong mechanically too; which bodes well for them in the wet. Red Bull's strength seems more aero; at least over the McLaren

[flynfrog]

If it rains I wouldn't count out the rainmeister. That car has been getting better all year.

[Gerhard Berger]

What's worrying for Vettel is that he hasn't won a wet race since China 2009, though at times he certainly has shown excellent pace in the wet throughout his career.

At the moment, no one on the current grid stands out as a rain master the way Schumacher or Senna used to. Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel and Button have all had their good and bad moments in the wet and alot seems to depends on the way the car handles its tyres.

[LionKing]

Vettel is usually the quickest guy during full wet periods in the races.

Korea last year, Silverstone and Canada this year...

He opened 9+ second gap to Webber in 2nd at the end of first 10 laps at Silverstone. In Canada similar staff. Only Schumacher in Canada was doing laps close to Vettel during the very wet period.

If Schumacher had a bit better machinery, I don't know which one would come on top at the present time, but he was certainly the best driver in rain I have witnessed in my ~20 years of as an F1 fan.

Before colliding with DC at Spa 98, the fastest lap of Micheal's Ferrari was 8 full seconds faster than Coulhard driving the McLaren Mercedes. On aggregate he put about 130 seconds to DC in 25 laps )

[beelsebob]

Vettel is usually the quickest guy during full wet periods in the races.

Korea last year, Silverstone and Canada this year...

At Silverstone, 1) it was only half wet 2) Hamilton was the one that really moved in the wet phase of the race, he was behind people so not lapping fast, but he was regularly overtaking everyone around him.
At Canada Hamilton was lapping faster than Vettel when in clear air, Alonso was also right up with his times.

[ringo]

Button isn't good on intermediates.
He has went fast on a dry line on slicks. Vettel is better than Button in any wet or drying conditions.
What Button has is wisdom to go into the pits for the slick tyre at the right time.

When it comes to intermediate tyre running and wet running, Alonso and Hamilton are top class. Vettel in Korea 2010 was also top class.
Vettel hasn't really impressed me much though in the wet. I chalk it up to the redbull.
Hamilton toying with him in Hungary was enough for me to draw that conclusion.

[jamsbong]

What's worrying for Vettel is that he hasn't won a wet race since China 2009, though at times he certainly has shown excellent pace in the wet throughout his career.

At the moment, no one on the current grid stands out as a rain master the way Schumacher or Senna used to. Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel and Button have all had their good and bad moments in the wet and alot seems to depends on the way the car handles its tyres.

Agree, I have not seen a proper rainmaster since Michael Schumacher. In fact, Schumacher was really mighty in Canada until the weather dried up. If they didn't stop the race, who knows... The old man impressed me continuously and I really hope he will continue to improve next year and onwards.

[jamsbong]

Just read this article about Rosberg vs Schumacher.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/formula ... 736348.stm

To me, Rosberg's strength is quali speed and consistent race pace. Schumacher will have that once he learns more and more about the tracks. Schumacher continues to have determination, experience and a competitive soul. This is what makes him exciting, like Vettel, Hamilton and Alonso. What I really find impressive is whenever the situation changes Schumacher is always able to adapt better than Rosberg. Even in Schumacher's early career, he was always one that excel when a lot is happening.

Of course, Hamilton and Button have both shown such adaptability especially this year. I think the Mclarens must be easier to drive on changing conditions.

[raymondu999]

Button isn't good on intermediates.
He has went fast on a dry line on slicks. Vettel is better than Button in any wet or drying conditions.
What Button has is wisdom to go into the pits for the slick tyre at the right time.

Agreed

When it comes to intermediate tyre running and wet running, Alonso and Hamilton are top class. Vettel in Korea 2010 was also top class.

Agreed, except I don't think Alonso is exceptional in the wet. He's kind of average in my mind; slightly under Hamilton/Vettel in terms of wet driving

[LionKing]

Vettel is usually the quickest guy during full wet periods in the races.

Korea last year, Silverstone and Canada this year...

At Silverstone, 1) it was only half wet 2) Hamilton was the one that really moved in the wet phase of the race, he was behind people so not lapping fast, but he was regularly overtaking everyone around him.
At Canada Hamilton was lapping faster than Vettel when in clear air, Alonso was also right up with his times.

I just checked one more time the lap times:

At Silverstone till the first pit stops, Vettel was faster than Hamilton all 11 laps except one lap (by 0.053 sec). He was 16 seconds in front at the end of lap 11.

Laptimes at Canada before Hamilton retires at lap 7:

---------Vettel----------Hamilton Delta Gap
1. 2:18.174 [1] 2:22.459 [5] -4.285 -4.285
2. 2:06.919 [1] 2:06.157 [5] +0.762 -3.523
3. 2:05.303 [1] 2:05.340 [5] -0.037 -3.560
4. 2:05.715 [1] 2:03.927 [5] +1.788 -1.772
5. 1:36.175 [1] 1:40.949 [6] -4.774 -6.546
6. 1:34.827 [1] 1:39.917 [7] -5.090 -11.636
7. 1:35.452 [1] 1:37.761 [7] -2.309 -13.945

[raymondu999]

LionKing - the Canada lap times don't tell the full picture; as Vettel would have been in clean air

[beelsebob]

At Silverstone till the first pit stops, Vettel was faster than Hamilton all 11 laps except one lap (by 0.053 sec). He was 16 seconds in front at the end of lap 11.

Yes he was – but as I said in my original post – Hamilton was held up behind people at Silverstone, he was however easily passing people on track.

Laptimes at Canada before Hamilton retires at lap 7:

---------Vettel----------Hamilton Delta Gap
1. 2:18.174 [1] 2:22.459 [5] -4.285 -4.285
2. 2:06.919 [1] 2:06.157 [5] +0.762 -3.523
3. 2:05.303 [1] 2:05.340 [5] -0.037 -3.560
4. 2:05.715 [1] 2:03.927 [5] +1.788 -1.772
5. 1:36.175 [1] 1:40.949 [6] -4.774 -6.546
6. 1:34.827 [1] 1:39.917 [7] -5.090 -11.636
7. 1:35.452 [1] 1:37.761 [7] -2.309 -13.945

Again – bottled up behind people – when Hamilton had clean air he was 0.7 faster, 0.03 slower, 1.8 faster