2012 Brazilian GP - Interlagos

[mbvinnie]

Talking about the race, how funny was Kimi's trip 'downtown' before he realized there was no way back to the track.
He really was a long way from the circuit...love the positive attitude...

[JimClarkFan]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

List every driver in the WDC and lets see the results.

Let the fan boys have their say with a click of a button, and let the neutrals have their say too.

And for all the talk I am not a fan boy, Button always has been my favourite driver in modern F1, Alonso won me over this season, although Hamilton was exceptional too.


I am not sure why everyone is soo hesitant to have a 'most deserving' discussion, because it does have meaning, and there will be a difference of opinion. If you can't handle disagreements stay out of the thread.

[mbvinnie]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

List every driver in the WDC and lets see the results.

Let the fan boys have their say with a click of a button and tot up the results.

And for all the talk I am not a fan boy, Button always has been my favourite driver in modern F1.

It won't prove anything, there is too much bias, it will just lead to unsubstantiated arguments and people claiming 'facts' about opinions.

NB: You can be biased towards drivers other than your favourite, and you can also be biased against drivers.
Also...I am not exactly sure what VET has done wrong, but he seems to be pretty unpopular right now. Too successful too soon? Tall Poppy?

[JimClarkFan]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

List every driver in the WDC and lets see the results.

Let the fan boys have their say with a click of a button and tot up the results.

And for all the talk I am not a fan boy, Button always has been my favourite driver in modern F1.

It won't prove anything, there is too much bias, it will just lead to unsubstantiated arguments and people claiming 'facts' about opinions.

NB: You can be biased towards drivers other than your favourite, and you can also be biased against drivers.
Also...I am not exactly sure what VET has done wrong, but he seems to be pretty unpopular right now. Too successful too soon? Tall Poppy?

Does the bias matter when it comes to the results. There is a good chance the true fan boys will even each other out, and if there is a landslide one way or another then surely that would speak for itself.

The reason why Vettel is so out of favour is because many feel he isn't deserving, yes that word again, but I'm afraid it keep cropping up because it does mean something.

[Intego]

I'll try a first and incomplete analysis on strategy when the first rain started. As so often if not always the official weather forecast was as good as something you can't describe politely. So once more it seemed to be the drivers' choice that panned out the best (e.g. Button and Hülkenberg staying out on slicks), though I don't exactly know all of the team radio. The leaders gained so much time with this decision, that Ricciardo on 3rd position (!) was lapped. We know now that only the Safety Car could screw this.

Two funny things: Some cars don't appear in the official Race History Chart (PDF) for one lap but fulfilling another lap twice.

When Hülkenberg passed Button both crossed the start-finish-line at the exact same time with a 0.000s time difference

[Intego]

I want to add that this thread is "under investigation".

[beelsebob]

I want to add that this thread is "under investigation".

Incident involving Members 12 and 63 under investigation?

Maybe this forum needs a rule – every time a thread is closed the mods need to file an FIA official penalty notice.

[Juzh]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

List every driver in the WDC and lets see the results.

Let the fan boys have their say with a click of a button and tot up the results.

And for all the talk I am not a fan boy, Button always has been my favourite driver in modern F1.

It won't prove anything, there is too much bias, it will just lead to unsubstantiated arguments and people claiming 'facts' about opinions.

NB: You can be biased towards drivers other than your favourite, and you can also be biased against drivers.
Also...I am not exactly sure what VET has done wrong, but he seems to be pretty unpopular right now. Too successful too soon? Tall Poppy?

People are still after 4 year not quite synced into reality that now there is a third championship contending team on the grid next to popular ferrari and mclaren. If vettel raced for either of them, he would be praised just like alonso is right now. It must be hard for all the ferrari supporters to see championships go away to "some drinks" company, according to montezemolo.

[mbvinnie]

Does the bias matter when it comes to the results. There is a good chance the true fan boys will even each other out, and if there is a landslide one way or another then surely that would speak for itself.

The reason why Vettel is so out of favour is because many feel he isn't deserving, yes that word again, but I'm afraid it keep cropping up because it does mean something.

The most deserving driver, including an Englishman (HAM), on an English language website?
It won't even itself out, it won't mean anything, it won't change anything.

It is impossible to properly analyse:
-ALO had advantages with retirements/incidents in front of him (HAM & VET losing points), a fast starting car, a car set-up to overtake, a team geared more around him, a reliable car, a more submissive teammate.
-ALO had bad luck in the Grosjean incident in Spa (my opinion is the incident with RAI was partly his fault - just an opinion), and a poor qualifying car.
VET had advantages of a car geared for overall laptime, a car that was very quick in qualy and decent in the race (especially at the end of the year)
VET had bad luck with KAR incident, Alternators, fuel penalty in Abu Dhabi.
HAM had probably worst luck of all - though not sure if he 'deserved' it more than the others

My opinion is that the poor qualy performance of ALO, added to a car that started well and passed well meant he appeared to always do well, whereas VET had a car that was great in qualy (esp. at the end) but was tough to start and overtake, which made it hard to shine. I don't know who was better - both looked good for different reasons.

How do you compare? Just enjoy 3 great drivers all driving very well.
VET happened to win this one - it could easily be HAM or ALO next.

Just like 2007 could easily have been ALO or HAM, and 2008 could easily have been MAS. It is what it is.

[McMrocks]

I can't believe it but this race was better than the USA GP. It was really interesting. With so many changes. It is representing the whole season. For example the race was unpredictable like the season was at the beginning.
I will never forget this race, honestly.

[Intego]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

Done. Poll: Who do you think deserves the WDC title the most?

[JimClarkFan]

Ok how about a poll thread then - 'Who in your opinion was the most deserving driver' this season.

Done. Poll: Who do you think deserves the WDC title the most?

thanks

[WhiteBlue]

I am not sure why everyone is soo hesitant to have a 'most deserving' discussion, because it does have meaning, and there will be a difference of opinion.

Because the issue has been discussed for the last six weeks. There is no reasonable point of view that has not been made in great detail. When a decision is made at the checkered flag it is the sporting behaviour to congratulate the winners and not to argue why the decision is wrong according to ones own preferences.

[Juzh]

Just to clarify this:
Vettel vs Kobayashi pass was made under a solid yellow, which equals a red and yellow flag (slippery surface). Not a flashing yellow which equals a yellow flag.
SKY had gotten it completely wrong this time.

[Dragonfly]

It's the end of the season, the final and very contradictory title deciding race. IMHO people here should be let release the steam. The race threads are non-technical by default, so letting some more emotion as long as there is not bad language, should be acceptable. Otherwise we have new threads or the fan-boy dispute drifts to the technical ones.
IMHO again.