2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

[bhall II]

[I changed my mind.]

[evered7]

BTW race results are not facts or official info, they are results.
And were are the "many Analyses" that you speak of? I see a lot of comments & reports that use the word "probably".

The facts are that Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 was out paced during the Sepang race.
As for Melbourne, the general consensus is that the track does not reflect correctly relative performance, but maybe that excuse is only relevant if the results are in favour of Mercedes AMG Petronas F1?
Also consider that Ferrari lost 20sec to Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 in the first 17 laps being stuck behind a slow Williams.
But again the excuse of slower cars in front only holds water if it tips the results in favour of Mercedes AMG Petronas F1?
So lets see what facts we get from Shanghai, by no means will it be a guaranteed Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 victory.

We have had two races in two totally different conditions. Can't really judge how the cars are going to perform until the European season starts and then there is in-season development as well.

Only thing that is clear is that Ferrari are a solid 2nd with the gap closer to Mercedes than the second placed team in 2014.

I believe Mercedes will be strong in China due to cooler temperatures. But if Ferrari can work the softer options better, then they will be in with a chance.

I am happy with Ferrari's resurgence and hope the team can take the fight to Mercedes. Mercedes also wouldn't suddenly lose their pace in one season after such dominance.

[dans79]

Ferrari didnt cut down a 35 second race advantage because there was no true 35 second advantage...in your brain the amount of seconds car 1 finishes ahead of car 2 is the advantage....that cannot be further from the truth....

how about the 1.4 second gap in qualifying, that the Ferrari drivers them selves said they could/might have been able to get down to 1.0 seconds. Not to mention, if the Ferrari is as good as so many of the people in red now claim, why was it stuck behind the Williams for as long as it was?

Also consider that Ferrari lost 20sec to Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 in the first 17 laps being stuck behind a slow Williams.
But again the excuse of slower cars in front only holds water if it tips the results in favour of Mercedes AMG Petronas F1?
So lets see what facts we get from Shanghai, by no means will it be a guaranteed Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 victory.

17 seconds over 20 laps, not the other way around.
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2015/03/15/h ... inal-laps/

You do realize, that this proves the Ferrari is slower, at least around Melborne right? Even after He cleared Massa, that gap doubled.

[SectorOne]

Ferrari didnt cut down a 35 second race advantage because there was no true 35 second advantage...in your brain the amount of seconds car 1 finishes ahead of car 2 is the advantage....that cannot be further from the truth....

Let me guess, Ferrari was just cruising and Mercedes was going flat out in Australia.
Ferrari had no answer for Mercedes in Australia. "They couldn´t hold a candle to Mercedes" as Allison put it.

Please enlighten everyone (as you normally do except it doesn´t even contain any outside information other then your own opinion)

[Chene_Mostert]

Ferrari didnt cut down a 35 second race advantage because there was no true 35 second advantage...in your brain the amount of seconds car 1 finishes ahead of car 2 is the advantage....that cannot be further from the truth....

Let me guess, Ferrari was just cruising and Mercedes was going flat out in Australia.
Ferrari had no answer for Mercedes in Australia. "They couldn´t hold a candle to Mercedes" as Allison put it.

Please enlighten everyone (as you normally do except it doesn´t even contain any outside information other then your own opinion)

Melbourne seems to be the only race that Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 fans feels comfortable with referencing atm. Hope it does not remain that way for the entire season.
The Melbourne race was a very conservative procession and not worthy of becoming the season benchmark.

[dans79]

Melbourne seems to be the only race that Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 fans feels comfortable with referencing atm. Hope it does not remain that way for the entire season.
The Melbourne race was a very conservative procession and not worthy of becoming the season benchmark.

Not at all, last year Malaysia was the only race anyone got close to Mercedes when Mercedes didn't screw something up, or have reliability problems. Despite the final gap, Nico had a great deal of trouble with Vettel.

[windwaves]

Slower quicky, doesn't mean slower by a second or so and sitting ducks to be overtaken.
Of course every car has to go through back markers, but look at the times they have to go through and analyze how it adds to the woes of tyre life.

He lost 1.6 seconds in 12 laps on lesser fuel than what would be at the start. That is every reason to believe his degradation would have been worse if he stayed out in the SC period.

On your second point, so Vettel would have gotten the same disadvantage as well like Hamilton while passing back markers I suppose?

The point is not that Mercedes weren't fast in Malaysia. They were, but couldn't sustain it. While Ferrari were a lil slower but were consistently in the same range, thus helping them win the race.

you need to recognize that the person you are talking to is a fanboy of mercedes... he will keep making excuses till the end of time.
1.Vettel was .7 seconds behind hamilton in DRS range on lap 3 with DRS about to be activated..
2.Mercedes got a freebie for a first pit stop behind the safety car on their first stop.....
3.no matter what mercedes did with or without a safety car Vettel was going to be ahead after mercedes first pit stop with the pass either on track( see point #1) or in the pits.
IMHO that was game set match vettel with the lead and one less stop to make with nore than enough pace to stay ahead
i could care less how hot it was... it was the exact same temp for ALL the teams.
i could care less what strategic error mercedes made... you dont get to use a perceived error they made as an excuse as to why they got beaten
then some want to look at lap times of different teams at different times in the race with different fuel loads albeit on the same tire really???
on the same tire at the start of the race with as close a fuel load as there could be hamilton could not shake vettel.

and that is a fact, something very few understand around here

[windwaves]

you need to recognize that the person you are talking to is a fanboy of mercedes... he will keep making excuses till the end of time.
1.Vettel was .7 seconds behind hamilton in DRS range on lap 3 with DRS about to be activated..
2.Mercedes got a freebie for a first pit stop behind the safety car on their first stop.....
3.no matter what mercedes did with or without a safety car Vettel was going to be ahead after mercedes first pit stop with the pass either on track( see point #1) or in the pits.
IMHO that was game set match vettel with the lead and one less stop to make with nore than enough pace to stay ahead
i could care less how hot it was... it was the exact same temp for ALL the teams.
i could care less what strategic error mercedes made... you dont get to use a perceived error they made as an excuse as to why they got beaten
then some want to look at lap times of different teams at different times in the race with different fuel loads albeit on the same tire really???
on the same tire at the start of the race with as close a fuel load as there could be hamilton could not shake vettel.

Blah blah blah, we all no you hate Mercedes

hate mercedes ? not in the least.... i remember going down the autobahn heading to Amsterdam from Mainz-Finthen flugplatz doing 339kph for most of the way....loved it... and the 300e i was driving.
Mercedes deserved their 2014 championship.. they won it fair and square and i have no issue with that..
my issue is not with mercedes at all its with some of the the fanboys that throw common sense out of the window.

well said ! I also have plenty of respect for Mercedes and what they havd accomplished (deeply embarassing especially for Ferrari). In fact I cannot stand RB now the biggest whiners in the circuit because they cannot get their ch*t together hence they accuse the world of their failures (reminds me of ex-wife ehehhe).

[Chene_Mostert]

Melbourne seems to be the only race that Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 fans feels comfortable with referencing atm. Hope it does not remain that way for the entire season.
The Melbourne race was a very conservative procession and not worthy of becoming the season benchmark.

Not at all, last year Malaysia was the only race anyone got close to Mercedes when Mercedes didn't screw something up, or have reliability problems. Despite the final gap, Nico had a great deal of trouble with Vettel.

If you consider a 24sec gap with " save fuel and engine" to the first Non Mercedes car then yes, last year RB was really close and had them under pressure...

[SectorOne]

Melbourne seems to be the only race that Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 fans feels comfortable with referencing atm.

We have one race with temperatures we can expect to see throughout the season.
And one with temperatures we probably won´t even see next year at Malaysia again, let alone any other race track on the calendar.

The Melbourne race was a very conservative procession and not worthy of becoming the season benchmark.

Sure. But a race with abnormal temperatures is perfectly ok even though the driver that won the race pointed out that heat probably skewed the actual performance delta of the two cars.

[windwaves]

He lost 1.6 seconds in 12 laps on lesser fuel than what would be at the start. That is every reason to believe his degradation would have been worse if he stayed out in the SC period.

On your second point, so Vettel would have gotten the same disadvantage as well like Hamilton while passing back markers I suppose?

The point is not that Mercedes weren't fast in Malaysia. They were, but couldn't sustain it. While Ferrari were a lil slower but were consistently in the same range, thus helping them win the race.

you need to recognize that the person you are talking to is a fanboy of mercedes... he will keep making excuses till the end of time.
1.Vettel was .7 seconds behind hamilton in DRS range on lap 3 with DRS about to be activated..
2.Mercedes got a freebie for a first pit stop behind the safety car on their first stop.....
3.no matter what mercedes did with or without a safety car Vettel was going to be ahead after mercedes first pit stop with the pass either on track( see point #1) or in the pits.
IMHO that was game set match vettel with the lead and one less stop to make with nore than enough pace to stay ahead
i could care less how hot it was... it was the exact same temp for ALL the teams.
i could care less what strategic error mercedes made... you dont get to use a perceived error they made as an excuse as to why they got beaten
then some want to look at lap times of different teams at different times in the race with different fuel loads albeit on the same tire really???
on the same tire at the start of the race with as close a fuel load as there could be hamilton could not shake vettel
Oh please, cut your crap. I am a fan of whoever who is winning, as I respect the hard work that they would put into, to be where they are. Be it Ferrari in 2000s, Red Bull in 2010+ or Merc now. In fact, I was one of those who were shouting that Ferrari has a highly improved PU, based on how Sauber was performing in Winter testing.
You have simply posted some hypothetical points here, which you cannot prove at all. I have given numbers from the race and was trying to tell that, there is no miracle in sight to believe that Ferrari is going to race wheel to wheel with Merc this year. The tyre degradation crap that is going on, there is nothing to really it back up, to say the tyre degradation is going to eat up Merc this year, without understanding race situation, is simply living on a pot shot. If you cannot understand and want to live in some kind of hallucination, so be it.
Just saw your user name, is this an irony that you keep a name like "GIANTFAN" and referring to someone's post as fanboyism?

yes, these are good points as well. I do not believe, intuitively that Ferrari has close the gap and that they are even near. I believe they have improved substantially and conditions in Malaysia proved favorable for a well deserved win. However I would be truly astonished if Ferrari was already competitive with Mercedes on a consisitent basis. We shall see

[windwaves]

you need to recognize that the person you are talking to is a fanboy of mercedes... he will keep making excuses till the end of time.
1.Vettel was .7 seconds behind hamilton in DRS range on lap 3 with DRS about to be activated..
2.Mercedes got a freebie for a first pit stop behind the safety car on their first stop.....
3.no matter what mercedes did with or without a safety car Vettel was going to be ahead after mercedes first pit stop with the pass either on track( see point #1) or in the pits.
IMHO that was game set match vettel with the lead and one less stop to make with nore than enough pace to stay ahead
i could care less how hot it was... it was the exact same temp for ALL the teams.
i could care less what strategic error mercedes made... you dont get to use a perceived error they made as an excuse as to why they got beaten
then some want to look at lap times of different teams at different times in the race with different fuel loads albeit on the same tire really???
on the same tire at the start of the race with as close a fuel load as there could be hamilton could not shake vettel.

Blah blah blah, we all no you hate Mercedes

hate mercedes ? not in the least.... i remember going down the autobahn heading to Amsterdam from Mainz-Finthen flugplatz doing 339kph for most of the way....loved it... and the 300e i was driving.
Mercedes deserved their 2014 championship.. they won it fair and square and i have no issue with that..
my issue is not with mercedes at all its with some of the the fanboys that throw common sense out of the window.

300e that fast ??

[dans79]

300e that fast ??

It's not even close to that fast stock, not to mention I'd be shocked if was aerodynamically stable at that speed.

[Andres125sx]

BTW race results are not facts or official info, they are results.

Exactly, results are results

We can discuss about everything, even results, but at least we know on race every team do their max, not like FP or pre-season testing

And were are the "many Analyses" that you speak of? I see a lot of comments & reports that use the word "probably".

Just an example from someone who know what he´s talking about much better than any of us
http://en.f1i.com/magazine/8353-the-fer ... cedes.html

From last paragraph of first page:

it's still too early to say if Ferrari can emerge as a real challenger for this year's title, especially since the excessive heat in Malaysia, with track temperatures reaching 62°C, may have been a disadvantage for Mercedes. Temperatures in China will certainly be a lot lower.

I see you will never believe any word said by any F1T member as you instantly think he must be a Mercedes fan, maybe you can believe Jacky Eeckelaert´s analysis

Belgian engineer Jacky Eeckelaert, who worked for Jordan, Prost GP, Sauber, Honda and HRT

As a note, I know Ferrari right now is the only team who can fight with Mercedes if circumstances are in favour to the red cars, but only if circumstances are in favour to them. At least that´s what most people think right now, including people inside Ferrari

Anycase we´ll see what happens this weekend, at least if you rely on results as a good indicator

[Chene_Mostert]

What happens if it is too cold in Shanghai? I remember Lewis complaining about Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 struggling with cooler temperatures during Barcelona test?