Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
bhall II
bhall II
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Joined: 19 Jun 2014, 20:15

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Blaze1 wrote:I don't have CFD eyes, but it looks to me like the new side pod design has been introduced to encourage the air to flow down the sides of the side pods and into the coke bottle region. It will basically be accentuating the influence of the side sloping pods.
CFD eyes or not, I think you're mostly right.

As seen on last year's car, they're definitely taking advantage of the Coanda effect to direct air flow.

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However, given the tendency for sidepods to generate lift, the purpose of the update appears to be a bit more involved.

In order for air flow to turn over a curved surface, it accelerates, and conservation of energy requires the exchange of static pressure, which is the force acting upon the surface, for dynamic pressure, which is the kinetic energy of the air flow that enables the acceleration.

(Static pressure + dynamic pressure = total pressure, which is constant for any given reference area, meaning static pressure is reduced wherever dynamic pressure is increased, and vice versa.)

In context, if that exchange results in lower static pressure over the sidepods than under the sidepods, it causes unwanted lift. The update seems to be focused on this area of performance.

Image

The vortex generators (yellow dot) would seem to create a turbulent boundary layer over the sidepod, which increases static pressure in that area (and is much easier to control than a laminar boundary layer). It might also reduce form/pressure drag.

The diagonal crease near the sidepod inlet (green dot) looks to form the beginning of a pressure gradient intended to steer air flow down and over the side toward the undercut. If so, and because it will inherently reduce mass flow over the sidepod downstream, thus reducing its dynamic pressure, it will increase static pressure acting upon the top of the sidepod.

The upturned vent (blue dot) signals added camber along the bottom surface relative to the top. As such, it should comprehensively increase the dynamic pressure of air flow along the entire length of the bodywork under the sidepod, which will reduce static pressure along the same lines.

Add it all up, and the net result appears to mimic an inverted airfoil, albeit one that's probably not very potent. Every little bit helps, though.

EDIT: It's also entirely possible that the upwash created by the added camber under the sidepod will increase the efficiency of both the rear wing and the diffuser, because it will have the same effect on those areas as a beam wing.

And since downstream phenomena have upstream effects, all of these things will make the front wing more efficient, too.
Last edited by bhall II on 08 May 2015, 09:26, edited 1 time in total.

Harsha
Harsha
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Joined: 01 Dec 2012, 14:35

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Ferrari: updates (Courtsy- Gianlu Dale)
- Bargeboard
- Engine cover
- Sidepod airflow conditioner
- Brakes
- Diffuser
- Sidepod
- Floor
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Last edited by Harsha on 08 May 2015, 09:48, edited 1 time in total.

OO7
OO7
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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bhall II wrote: As seen on last year's car, they're definitely taking advantage of the Coanda effect to direct air flow................................
Great post bhall and excellent images, thank you.

So essentially there will be a trade in dynamic pressure between the top surface of the side pods and the side surfaces, with the sides of the pods gaining dynamic pressure and the top surfaces gaining static pressure?
If this is the case, I wonder if there is an influence (that can be harnessed/controlled) on stability due to side forces?

BTW, have you seen any photos that shows flow vis over the forward parts (around the flow conditioners) of the Ferrari side pod?

OO7
OO7
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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PlatinumZealot wrote:The effect of this cut:

Reduced high pressure zone on leading edge of side pod.

Increased down-wash velocity to the coka bottle

Reduced frontal area and hence drag

Higher velocity going to the corner strakes (squirers) leading to the diffuser.

http://img1.auto-motor-und-sport.de/Fer ... 862363.jpg
Looking at the following image below, I don't think there is a notable change in frontal area PZ:
Image
There may be a slight reduction right at the outer edge of the new cutout, but it is difficult to see without a head-on shot.

bhall II
bhall II
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Blaze1 wrote:So essentially there will be a trade in dynamic pressure between the top surface of the side pods and the side surfaces, with the sides of the pods gaining dynamic pressure and the top surfaces gaining static pressure?
If this is the case, I wonder if there is an influence (that can be harnessed/controlled) on stability due to side forces?

BTW, have you seen any photos that shows flow vis over the forward parts (around the flow conditioners) of the Ferrari side pod?
In a manner of speaking, I think the idea is to consolidate air flow along the undercuts, which should create some downforce. Even if it only makes the sidepods aero-neutral, that's beneficial

And I've not seen any FlowVis imagery. (I think this might be the first time the team's ever used VGs of this type.)

I imagine it would probably look something like this, except with coverage over most of the bodywork.

Image

chuckdanny
chuckdanny
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Great flowvis on the redbull, it seems we see the effect of the undercut vortex if i'm not mistaken. The streamlines could not be that vertical going toward the top of the floor unless it's turning. And it seems that we see a change of helicity starting from the strakes, vortex stretching and reinforcing squeezed by tyre wake? It would turn anticlockwise as seen from rear of the car like y250 and bargeboard vortices.
I always wonder how the thin engine cover could transmit downforce or lift it's so thin, the LE of sidepod that embed side crash structure are transmitting but this little thin skin? THere is higher pressure underneath due to cooling systems plus it could adjust a bit by deforming it think

And great flowvis of 2014 ferrari which show clearly two different areas. THe abrubt coke bottle shape unlike the progressive redbull one divert the undercut flow to the outside (inner part of rear tire) thus they use y250 and bargeboard vortices quit differently that is toward the outside part of diffuser like the exhaust did whereas redbull uses it at the center part of diffuser.
It seems that to steer the sidewashed sidepod flow toward this area a favorable pressure gradient is formed that attract the sidedownwash by the undercut flow steering hence the flow as a vertical component going toward the floor unless the one that would come from the undercut hence enhance pressure over the upper part of the raked floor and diffuser... maybe...

bhall II
bhall II
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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I'm pretty sure any downforce created by the sidepods is nowhere near enough to compromise the integrity of the bodywork. In fact, it's more likely that internal pressure will cause a bit of a blowout instead.

Image

(And be careful not to read too much into FlowVis patterns. We don't know anything about the conditions that caused those streamlines.)

chuckdanny
chuckdanny
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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I'm pretty sure any downforce created by the sidepods is nowhere near enough to compromise the integrity of the bodywork
That's what i said, nothing to transmit to the chassis... or by mistake
And be careful not to read too much into FlowVis patterns. We don't know anything about the conditions that caused those streamlines.
You mean they tested the car going backward?

So basically this new engine cover achieve the same as the winglets without vortices shed by those winglets.
It's very hard to know which is better and why but we can always hazard one or two ideas, there is much more surfaces to steer the flow so greater effect but i think there is a little drag penalty which they take on the upgraded PU.
Last edited by chuckdanny on 08 May 2015, 11:56, edited 1 time in total.

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turbof1
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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chuckdanny wrote:
I'm pretty sure any downforce created by the sidepods is nowhere near enough to compromise the integrity of the bodywork
That's what i said, nothing to transmit to the chassis... or by mistake
And be careful not to read too much into FlowVis patterns. We don't know anything about the conditions that caused those streamlines.
You mean they tested the car going backward?
He probably meant things like wind have an effect on these things.
#AeroFrodo

bhall II
bhall II
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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chuckdanny wrote:
And be careful not to read too much into FlowVis patterns. We don't know anything about the conditions that caused those streamlines.
You mean they tested the car going backward?
No, but if the photos were taken while the car was leaving pit lane, the streamlines aren't going to look like those that would be created at 200mph.

chuckdanny
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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In fact, it's more likely that internal pressure will cause a bit of a blowout instead.
Be cautious! it could be many things like a bad screwing in rush hour or vibration together with temperature degrading engine cover mechanical caracteristics on some part.

f300v10
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Vortext generator at bottom of sidepod, via AMUS:

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f300v10
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Front wing spec appears unchanged, at least in this shot:

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Morteza
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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Via AMuS
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

f300v10
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF15-T

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After a closer look in this shot, I believe the white upper flaps have changed on the front wing. The leading edge radius appears larger, and the angle of the 'corner' on the trailing edge is more abrupt than the above spec. Note both this shot and the one above are from today, so Ferrari trialing two front wings:

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