2018 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 27-29 July

[cooken]

For me, the Vettel/Bottas incident was a racing incident. Vettel shouldn't have cut across so tight, Bottas shouldn't have been so late on the brakes when he'd already lost it.

Bottas does though deserve slagged off for the Ricciardo incident.

What is your opinion on France T1 incident?

This is annoying. France was multiple races ago. This is the Hungarian GP. Also Moose summary and interpretation is quite fair and concise. It needs no further context.

One will continue to be frustrated and bewildered by stewards decisions and others opinions if always seeking to compare incidents across tracks and in different situations. The rules (written and otherwise) of racing are very nuanced and in general this means that isolated incidents are track, corner and situation specific. I.e. comparing a T1 race start incident in France to a T2 late race incident in Hungary is nonsensical.

[Just_a_fan]

Just watched the highlights and it looked like Vettel just thought he was further ahead of Bottas than he was. Perhaps he forgot that Bottas was on the dirty line with very worn tyres. Bottas certainly locked up trying to avoid him. Racing incident but with a "be more careful Seb" added to the notes.

The tangle with Danny looked purely racing incident too. Danny turned in before Bottas had got slowed down - Bottas was again trying not to hit him but had nowhere to go. Perhaps Bottas should have braked earlier but then he was racing for the place so defending is ok.

[MtthsMlw]

Verstappen's RTL interview:

Reporter: Max, what a catastrophe. Very annoying of course, goes without saying. What was the reason, what happened?

Max: I think something with the engine. But I haven't asked anything yet. Of course it's s*** that this happens.

So you haven't talked with any of your team so far?

No.

Why not?

I don't care in the end.

Something has to happen over the summer break, you are very dissatisfied, we've seen that over the last few races. What has to change now?

Our engine is way too slow. No power there. Reliability is also s***. That's not how it should be.

Personally you probably can't draw any big consequences now, it wasn't your fault, but what have to be the consequences after such a race?

Well, we pay many millions to Renault for a good engine, normally. But it's complete s***.

Waiting for Honda now is quite the long time, isn't it?

Yes, anyway we don't compete for the championship, so it's a bit different, but it's not good.

[NYGIANTS]

It was really a shame Ferrari mechanics made mistake. If Vettel had come out in front of Bottas, we would have an epic battle between Hamilton and Vettel for the win.

The trouble is we dont know how much pace Lewis or Seb had. So it may not have been the case. Even if Vettel caught Lewis , Seb wouldn't have passed. Seb only passed Bottas because his tyres were so worn. Lewis had 10 less laps on his tyres. So Lewis would never have had the tyre problems that bot had.

I am sure Vet would be there with Lewis in DRS range. However, it would definitely be harder to pass than Bottas. I still think he would have a chance. One slow motion showed how bad Hamilton tyres (I think they were about 15 laps old at that momemnt) were.

we were robbed of vettel chasing hamilton in the end, but as my buddy said, vettel/ferrari had bottas covered (22secs) and they mucked up not just the pit stop but waiting too long to pit based on the times.

lewis tires was fine at lap 15 on the softs and in the end, what we saw was not delamination but just klag he picked up.

now how they would've looked if vettel was coming up his rear at a clip is a different story that we never got a chance to see.

[cooken]

Crofty saying...

Can we all agree Crofty is a bit of a doofus? Let's maybe not put too much stock in what he says.
Always blows my mind he still can't round to the nearest tenth after his many years doing this. Can be 0.190 and he'll just look at the first number and call it a tenth.

Sorry... struck a nerve.

[Partymood]

Ferrari knew that Mercs would use Bottas,again, to slow them down so they decided to go with a one stop overcut strategy for Vettel, tell him to go easy on them after the pit stop then push at the very end. Everyone thought his tires had already gone off but quite the opposite. It almost worked but at least it got him a second place.
Too bad they messed up the tyres change and that SAINZ went throught 9 (nine) blue flags before letting Vettel through costing him in total about 5 seconds. I am amazed that the incidend wasn't even investigated by the stewards.

Only Hamilton thinks that Ferrari had a bad strategy

("...It seems Sky no longer cares to maintain even a little objectivity and professionalism. Only two people in Hungary thought Vettel should have shouldered any blame for Bottas hitting him, unfortunately, the two happened to be commentating on the race to a global audience of millions. The sooner Sky lose their strangle hold on F1 broadcasting rights, the better". NOT_BOB on Sky Sports News) oh well, the clowns on Channel 4 UK ae just the same.
Then they complain that Ferrari staff don't want to talk to them...

[Just_a_fan]

("...It seems Sky no longer cares to maintain even a little objectivity and professionalism. Only two people in Hungary thought Vettel should have shouldered any blame for Bottas hitting him,

I think you'll find that there are a few people who think that Vettel had a bit to do with it. There have been a few posting on here, for example.

Welcome to the forum, by the way.

[Zynerji]

I think Seb just believed Valt would yield the corner after he was passed.

That thinking was definitely Sebs fault.

[LM10]

Just watched the highlights and it looked like Vettel just thought he was further ahead of Bottas than he was. Perhaps he forgot that Bottas was on the dirty line with very worn tyres. Bottas certainly locked up trying to avoid him. Racing incident but with a "be more careful Seb" added to the notes.

The tangle with Danny looked purely racing incident too. Danny turned in before Bottas had got slowed down - Bottas was again trying not to hit him but had nowhere to go. Perhaps Bottas should have braked earlier but then he was racing for the place so defending is ok.

Look at it again. Look at how Bottas understeered straight out of the track. If Seb would have not turned like he did and instead waited and gave Bottas the space he needed, Vettel would have been pushed even more out of the track onto the grass.

What about “use your brain and be more careful Bottas”? Use the brain in terms of knowing that the tyres were gone, so not trying some heroic and completely unnecessary defending moves. Eventually it cost Bottas 2 places in one corner.

[GrandAxe]

What Vettel did was just stupid.

Why risk throwing away the entire race with a DNF, especially when Bottas is no where near being a championship rival? Its hard to fathom his decision making. He is fast, but has zero race craft.
How many prangs has he had this year now? I'd love to see Leclerc at Ferrari replacing not Kimi, but Vettel.

[foxmulder_ms]

Verstappen's RTL interview:

Reporter: Max, what a catastrophe. Very annoying of course, goes without saying. What was the reason, what happened?

Max: I think something with the engine. But I haven't asked anything yet. Of course it's s*** that this happens.

So you haven't talked with any of your team so far?

No.

Why not?

I don't care in the end.

Something has to happen over the summer break, you are very dissatisfied, we've seen that over the last few races. What has to change now?

Our engine is way too slow. No power there. Reliability is also s***. That's not how it should be.

Personally you probably can't draw any big consequences now, it wasn't your fault, but what have to be the consequences after such a race?

Well, we pay many millions to Renault for a good engine, normally. But it's complete s***.

Waiting for Honda now is quite the long time, isn't it?

Yes, anyway we don't compete for the championship, so it's a bit different, but it's not good.

RedBull is THE last team I would do business with. Honda will be buying a team and going alone after next year since RedBull will keep blaming them too. Very toxic language.

[Brenton]

Have any of you ever heard such harsh criticism in F1 by a team towards their engine supplier, or any other similar sort of relationship? Or even in other pro sports? Wow, the way they ripped into Renault today.

Bottas lost his mind today, not only showing an awful ability to judge his grip in two incidents but also in post-race he half-blamed Danny for the T1 incident

RE Vettel: It's standard tactic when overtaking, when you clear an opponent before corner entry that you hold as close of an inside line as possible to prevent them from getting alongside you. F1 drivers do that all the time on corners where the normal racing line isn't hugging the inside curbs. Vettel was 0% at fault imo.

Vettel could have been more cautious and entered the corner taking the normal racing line (far right side of the track before turning into the corner) and given a couple car-widths of space on the inside through the apex . That would have increased the risk of being passed but I think he still 95% chance would have come out of 2 ahead. Would have been better to take that 5% risk of being overtaken , because it would drastically reduce the risk of being hit.

The fact that Kimi was right behind is a factor too. Vettel should have considered that Bottas is not only trying to fight him but also stay ahead of Kimi, so of course Bottas isn't going to just back off comfortably entering 2, accepting losing the position to Vettel, because that would risk him losing another position to Kimi. Vettel put too much faith in Bottas not bottling it.

Reminds me of Singapore... too negative of a mindset, too defensive and pessimistic. Too concerned that he couldn't beat his opponent(s) by taking a normal racing line so he tries to force the opponent into backing off. This could have been another DNF, a total disaster!

Ferrari and Vettel would have a comfortable WDC and WCC lead by now in my opinion if not for a combination of a lot of bad luck (losing wins due to VSC/SC lottery), bad strategies, really bad wet weather performance, and Vettel's mistakes at Baku, France, and Germany. Vettel continues to show great driving in both qualy and race pace, but those few 1 second lapses of judgment are so costly.

Sets up a great 2nd half to the season. Vettel is the fastest right now yet so far he's only finished on the podium 58% of the time! (7/12) If he averages finishing 3 points ahead of Hamilton the rest of the season he'll win the WDC by 3 points.

[LM10]

I think Seb just believed Valt would yield the corner after he was passed.

That thinking was definitely Sebs fault.

Yea, the thinking was definitely Seb’s fault.
Go tell all the drivers to take all the corners much wider than normal next time because there could always be the danger of any other driver hitting you.

[LM10]

What Vettel did was just stupid.

Why risk throwing away the entire race with a DNF, especially when Bottas is no where near being a championship rival? Its hard to fathom his decision making. He is fast, but has zero race craft.
How many prangs has he had this year now? I'd love to see Leclerc at Ferrari replacing not Kimi, but Vettel.

The 4 time world champion does have zero race craft?
Vettel should have not raced Bottas because Bottas is not a championship contender? What are you even talking about?!
Do you know that you get more points with a higher finish?

Some negative comments towards Vettel get really ridiculous already. It’s like people search for things to blame Vettel for.

[sosic2121]

For me, the Vettel/Bottas incident was a racing incident. Vettel shouldn't have cut across so tight, Bottas shouldn't have been so late on the brakes when he'd already lost it.

Bottas does though deserve slagged off for the Ricciardo incident.

What is your opinion on France T1 incident?

This is annoying. France was multiple races ago. This is the Hungarian GP. Also Moose summary and interpretation is quite fair and concise. It needs no further context.

One will continue to be frustrated and bewildered by stewards decisions and others opinions if always seeking to compare incidents across tracks and in different situations. The rules (written and otherwise) of racing are very nuanced and in general this means that isolated incidents are track, corner and situation specific. I.e. comparing a T1 race start incident in France to a T2 late race incident in Hungary is nonsensical.

Silly me excepting consistency from stewards. You got me there.