2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

[ALO_Power]

I don't know if people wants to see cars driving around all polite or actually watch racers race. The fine line between a brilliant move and a reckless move is very thin and it takes 2 drivers to define it. Looking back at Senna's races, is he a brilliant driver or someone who cause too many accidents? How about the move Alonso pulled on Schumacher in Suzuka at 130R and if Schumacher had close the door on him?

I think in the past the stewards have had made too many racing incident into penalties. This race has been very refreshing to see many of the incidents deemed racing incidents.

Exactly my thoughts as well. ...
I even dare to say most drivers and Fans became pussies after all these years, they don't know what real driving is anymore

I guess u need to sit back and learn from Leclerc of what a real rookie great can be. Super fast, intelligent, fair player, team player and modest. About Red Bull in WCC, don't be so sure but if so that will happen more thanks to Red Bull's chassis than engine. This is the McLaren topic though, please stay on topic.

Anyway, decent mileage in the testing today, 118 laps in total. Hopefully will help with the future updates.

[rogazilla]

yea basically. its not something that is going to get penalties dished out. it just sucks when a million fans watching are telling Sainz, "dont f#king try it dude!" through their tv.

Except that I like Carlos more because he went for it! I am more excited about McL's 2 drivers because of this race!

[Morteza]

Already posted this in the in-season testing thread, but thought I'd post it here too. Fernando's comments on MCL34

“It’s a step forward in every aspect of the car. I think the car has more grip, the car is less draggy on the straights, and the engine is a bigger step better as well,” Alonso said.

“Overall, as a package, I think the car is on the right direction.

“Obviously we saw in the first two races there is still another step to do if you want to compete with the top three teams, but as a first step I think, hopefully consolidate as the fourth [fastest] team or lead the midfield together with Haas.

“That’s the target. I felt that on the car as well.”

[mwillems]

Max was defending, Ricciardo was dive bombing to overtake (and it was against Bottas who is cautious). Situations are quite different.

For Norris, he talked after the race that he still does not have confidence to pull the big moves, he is still learning the car and race craft needed to race in Formula 1. In my opinion that is a really good attitude, he is a rookie, there is much to learn, by being a bit more cautious he gets to run full races with plenty of action. In this race he first had plenty of laps for practicing overtaking through the field (passed with flying colors) and then at the end had to nurse the car home with a possible brake issue and with a former world champion on his back. If he was more aggresive, he might have crashed early on and lost a great opportunity to learn.

But still, he will need to learn to be more aggressive and make it work.

For me, Max had lost the place and went on the attack to get it back. He may have been defending but it soon turned into an attempted overtake on Sainz. He just was very quick to get right back on it. Fair play to him.

I guess this is one of those arguments that no one will ever win, since it’s a matter of perspective... For me, Max isn’t “aggressive”, he is simply reckless and overdrives the car... He could have easily avoided the crash with Sainz and could have broke “at the normal braking point” and nothing would have happened, but his immaturity wins and he has the need to try to outbrake a car that has already taken control of the corner.

This time, Verstappen got away with it, but so far in his career it has already cost him (thinking Baku vs RIC or even better not letting Ocon get by in Brazil, leaving a Win on the table)... This is what I believe differentiate “Great Drivers” from “Very Good Ones”... The great drivers know that all the “aggressive” moves are useless if they don’t make it to the finish and would much rather lose a position than not get any points... Verstappen is a Good Driver in what has been a Great Car, who knows if he will ever become a Great Driver, but he needs to mature first to get there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I think you're right for most things in here, it is perspective.

Senna was reckless and had much the same split of comments then as Verstappen now.

I'm not for one second putting verstappen at sennas level, before you all get your pitchforks out.

[mwillems]

https://twitter.com/pirellisport/status ... 0347660290

Looks like they may have learnt from their mistake.

Obviously the guys need a few more tires to get the car dialled in AND have enough for the race.

[rogazilla]

Except the tire choices are done pre-season i believe. Why do people keep thinking they pick their tires before the race... or am I wrong about this?
EDIT: I found my answer

FIA F1 2019 sporting regulations section 24.2b

Competitors must then inform the FIA, no less than 8 weeks before the start of each event held in Europe and fourteen weeks before the start of each event held outside Europe, which specifications of dry-weather tyres they wish to use for each of their drivers

[mwillems]

Except the tire choices are done pre-season i believe. Why do people keep thinking they pick their tires before the race... or am I wrong about this?
EDIT: I found my answer

FIA F1 2019 sporting regulations section 24.2b

Competitors must then inform the FIA, no less than 8 weeks before the start of each event held in Europe and fourteen weeks before the start of each event held outside Europe, which specifications of dry-weather tyres they wish to use for each of their drivers

Except for the first race I would think that tyre choices wouldnt happen before pre season testing ? But i dont know if that is the case.

[FittingMechanics]

Except the tire choices are done pre-season i believe. Why do people keep thinking they pick their tires before the race... or am I wrong about this?
EDIT: I found my answer

FIA F1 2019 sporting regulations section 24.2b

Competitors must then inform the FIA, no less than 8 weeks before the start of each event held in Europe and fourteen weeks before the start of each event held outside Europe, which specifications of dry-weather tyres they wish to use for each of their drivers

Sorry, seemed more likely that tire choices are done closer to the race, but I guess logistics are an issue. I am guessing Pirelli ships them by sea so they need a lot of advance notice. Interesting choice regardless, could help them if they can get into Q3.

[diffuser]

But still, he will need to learn to be more aggressive and make it work.

For me, Max had lost the place and went on the attack to get it back. He may have been defending but it soon turned into an attempted overtake on Sainz. He just was very quick to get right back on it. Fair play to him.

I guess this is one of those arguments that no one will ever win, since it’s a matter of perspective... For me, Max isn’t “aggressive”, he is simply reckless and overdrives the car... He could have easily avoided the crash with Sainz and could have broke “at the normal braking point” and nothing would have happened, but his immaturity wins and he has the need to try to outbrake a car that has already taken control of the corner.

This time, Verstappen got away with it, but so far in his career it has already cost him (thinking Baku vs RIC or even better not letting Ocon get by in Brazil, leaving a Win on the table)... This is what I believe differentiate “Great Drivers” from “Very Good Ones”... The great drivers know that all the “aggressive” moves are useless if they don’t make it to the finish and would much rather lose a position than not get any points... Verstappen is a Good Driver in what has been a Great Car, who knows if he will ever become a Great Driver, but he needs to mature first to get there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I think you're right for most things in here, it is perspective.

Senna was reckless and had much the same split of comments then as Verstappen now.

I'm not for one second putting verstappen at sennas level, before you all get your pitchforks out.

I don't think you can compare him to Senna's generation, the driving was much different back then. Think the contact was expected back then.

I agree though, when you make contact there is as much a chance that Max get a puncture/damage as the other guy. If the commonality of contact is often Max with someone else, he'll have his share of retirements, like he did at the beginning of last year.

What's worse is that RBR don't have Ricardo to pickup the points when Max is having his run ins. It could turn out to be very expensive for RBR in the championship points category. I'm sure Christian must be preaching that to Max.

[diffuser]

Did they make this choice after the tests?

14 weeks before the weekend. Not a wise choice in my opinion. 2 stop is probably the faster strategy given cars are easier to overtake - as witnessed in Bahrain - and China has historically been tough on the tyres. Medium will probably be the preferred race tyre again but who knows, since the hard is c2 - unlike in Sakhir - it might be better.

It all depends on what you use during FP and Quali

I believe the regs are you can carry 7 tires into quali. This is what was left after Quali.



I believe all the cars that make it into Q3, their 7th tire is the tire they made their best time in Q2 with.

They'll probably bring 4 red, 2 yellow and use FP to figure out which will be the 7th tire. Obviously it can only be Red or white.

[Still an Iceman]

Yeah well to those whom it might concern..... keep on dreaming that a Renault (yes any powered renault team) will end in front of RB in the WCC

Well...

https://twitter.com/Foton_16/status/111 ... 33/video/1

If that is proper racing for you... Okay then

[Capharol]

Yeah well to those whom it might concern..... keep on dreaming that a Renault (yes any powered renault team) will end in front of RB in the WCC

Well...

https://twitter.com/Foton_16/status/111 ... 33/video/1

If that is proper racing for you... Okay then

when you look properly... Max has his steeringwheel turned but due to the curb (because Sainz didn't let him any space, Max had to take it) he had no full control... the car jumped a bit and there Max wasn't in fault.... the stewarts (who considered this as a racing incident), all commentators on Sky F1, ESPN even RTL Germany Sainz steered in TO EARLY ....

Baiting removed.

[diffuser]

Yeah well to those whom it might concern..... keep on dreaming that a Renault (yes any powered renault team) will end in front of RB in the WCC

Well...

https://twitter.com/Foton_16/status/111 ... 33/video/1

If that is proper racing for you... Okay then

I don't know what right or wrong any more. It's obvious that Saintz was ahead BUT didn't put his car directly in front of Max to force him to slow down. Max seeing the space broke slower than Saintz and tried to stay alongside of him instead of giving up the place. If Saintz would have moved in front of Max we probably would have had a re-occurrence of Baku, so clearily moving in front of him isn't an option.
Should Saintz have left more room ?
Probably
Would leaving more space have prevented contact?
If you look at how wide Max went on the exit.... I don't see how they would NOT have made contact later on.

[zeph]

The difference between the days of Senna and now is back then you could die any moment in an F1 car, so doing crazy s—t required big cojones. These days the cars are super-safe, so being reckless doesn’t carry the death penalty like it used to.

Verstappen is gonna keep on doin what he does with impunity, until one day it’ll lose him the championship.

[mwillems]

I guess this is one of those arguments that no one will ever win, since it’s a matter of perspective... For me, Max isn’t “aggressive”, he is simply reckless and overdrives the car... He could have easily avoided the crash with Sainz and could have broke “at the normal braking point” and nothing would have happened, but his immaturity wins and he has the need to try to outbrake a car that has already taken control of the corner.

This time, Verstappen got away with it, but so far in his career it has already cost him (thinking Baku vs RIC or even better not letting Ocon get by in Brazil, leaving a Win on the table)... This is what I believe differentiate “Great Drivers” from “Very Good Ones”... The great drivers know that all the “aggressive” moves are useless if they don’t make it to the finish and would much rather lose a position than not get any points... Verstappen is a Good Driver in what has been a Great Car, who knows if he will ever become a Great Driver, but he needs to mature first to get there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I think you're right for most things in here, it is perspective.

Senna was reckless and had much the same split of comments then as Verstappen now.

I'm not for one second putting verstappen at sennas level, before you all get your pitchforks out.

I don't think you can compare him to Senna's generation, the driving was much different back then. Think the contact was expected back then.

I agree though, when you make contact there is as much a chance that Max get a puncture/damage as the other guy. If the commonality of contact is often Max with someone else, he'll have his share of retirements, like he did at the beginning of last year.

What's worse is that RBR don't have Ricardo to pickup the points when Max is having his run ins. It could turn out to be very expensive for RBR in the championship points category. I'm sure Christian must be preaching that to Max.

Senna, against the context of his generation was considered reckless and dangerous by many. In much the same way as Max is in the context of this generation.
It was whilst being interviewed on this matter by Jackie Stewart that he made the famous quote "If you no longer go for a gap which exists you are no longer a racing driver...."

But Senna is celebrated by many, but that is as much down to personality and popularity. Senna could be a d**k in the car, but out of it he was very human and caring. Max, to me at least, largely seems like a self centered d**k, and so he bears the brunt of that dislike in many fans reaction to him. But personally I enjoy his style but have no affinity with him.

Your last point is very very true, in fact this may be the year he has to grow up and be the leader or things might get rough for him. I hadn't considered that narrative for the year. Interesting times.