2019 [R09] Austrian Grand Prix, Spielberg, 28-30 June

[Just_a_fan]

Look-where-his-head-is-ponting-in-each-lap. Full focus on the track on lap 68, full focus on Leclerc on lap 69. He clearly learns fast.

https://streamable.com/p1bt2

Wow, good catch. I completely missed that one. Definitely even more damning this.

Eh? He's looking exactly the same in both shots except where on the second one he looks in the left mirror after the corner to see where Leclerc is.

[Shrieker]

Leclercs mistake was that when he saw max going inside he didn't went in and blocked him totally

You cannot move under braking to block. It's not allowed.

[DutchDopey]

For some drivers it is a signature move... How many penalty points would this compilation account for.

[Just_a_fan]

In hindsight yes, but he had no idea Max was going to force him off the track.

If you leave a gap that wide, with a faster driver behind you, not expecting that he would take that line is naive. Leclec almost ran off track at the corner entry.

But he did the first time round, didn't he Although expecting that from Verstappen of all people a 2nd time is in fact naive.

In the first attempt, Leclerc was able to get on the power early and out drag Max. Max saw this and changed his line slightly to prevent the early drag from Leclerc. Leclerc, however, just tried to do the same thing as he had previously, not seeing that the dynamic was different. Max learnt and adjusted his method. Leclerc didn't. That's the difference and that's why, at the moment, Max is the better racer than Charles, even if Charles is still an exceptional talent. If Charles learns, he'll get better. If he doesn't learn, he'll get bitter and do something silly next time.

[Just_a_fan]

For some drivers it is a signature move... How many penalty points would this compilation account for.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEbzF0wRRME

None. He'd get no penalty points for any of those because they're all ok.

I think part of the problem is that so many of the grid are used to DRS-only overtakes and have forgotten how to defend. After all, no one overtakes under brakes in to corners any more, do they? Oh, oops! Some do.

[NathanOlder]

Isn't squeezing someone to the apex that late (as Max was only alongside very late) moving around in the braking zone. I thought that wasn't allowed.

Scrap that. Max has been doing/getting away with that for years.

It's been an unspoken allowed move for a long time. In other words the drivers and stewards have always allowed a driver overtaking on the inside to squeeze the defending driver out. Caveats beings it has to be done in a way that doesn't endanger the defending driver, or cause an accident. You can literally see this almost every season.

It caused a Collision! And yes drivers have been allowed to squeeze another out, but nearly every time its been OK is when the lead driver is at least 75% ahead. Not side by side.

[NathanOlder]

For some drivers it is a signature move... How many penalty points would this compilation account for.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEbzF0wRRME

None. He'd get no penalty points for any of those because they're all ok.

I think part of the problem is that so many of the grid are used to DRS-only overtakes and have forgotten how to defend. After all, no one overtakes under brakes in to corners any more, do they? Oh, oops! Some do.

Out of interest, how many of those did Danny run the other guy out wide and off the track while side by side?

[dans79]

It caused a Collision! And yes drivers have been allowed to squeeze another out, but nearly every time its been OK is when the lead driver is at least 75% ahead. Not side by side.

i wouldn't agree with that look at Hamilton and Rosberg in japan 2015. Lewis squeezed Nico out and he was nowhere close to 75% ahead, more like 5%. COTA 2015 Lewis squeezed him out as well. Lewis wasn't even ahead and they made contact.

No penalties in either case.

[NathanOlder]

Both incidents on opening lap and opening corner. One in the wet. Everyone knows opening lap and opening corner is a time when the stewards allow the drivers much more leeway due to so many cars in close proximity.

Much like Spain this year, Vettel crowding out Leclerc at T2, and Leclerc crowding out Gasly I think it was at T3. Its allowed at the start rightly or wrong. Not on lap 69 it shouldn't be allowed.

[Shrieker]

If you leave a gap that wide, with a faster driver behind you, not expecting that he would take that line is naive. Leclec almost ran off track at the corner entry.

But he did the first time round, didn't he Although expecting that from Verstappen of all people a 2nd time is in fact naive.

In the first attempt, Leclerc was able to get on the power early and out drag Max. Max saw this and changed his line slightly to prevent the early drag from Leclerc. Leclerc, however, just tried to do the same thing as he had previously, not seeing that the dynamic was different. Max learnt and adjusted his method. Leclerc didn't. That's the difference and that's why, at the moment, Max is the better racer than Charles, even if Charles is still an exceptional talent. If Charles learns, he'll get better. If he doesn't learn, he'll get bitter and do something silly next time.

I hope if he ever gets the chance to divebomb and push Max wide at the exit, he does exactly that. According to Max fans, that's fair. But not only is it dirty, but also illegal.

[NathanOlder]

But he did the first time round, didn't he Although expecting that from Verstappen of all people a 2nd time is in fact naive.

In the first attempt, Leclerc was able to get on the power early and out drag Max. Max saw this and changed his line slightly to prevent the early drag from Leclerc. Leclerc, however, just tried to do the same thing as he had previously, not seeing that the dynamic was different. Max learnt and adjusted his method. Leclerc didn't. That's the difference and that's why, at the moment, Max is the better racer than Charles, even if Charles is still an exceptional talent. If Charles learns, he'll get better. If he doesn't learn, he'll get bitter and do something silly next time.

I hope if he ever gets the chance to divebomb and push Max wide at the exit, he does exactly that. According to Max fans, that's fair. But not only is it dirty, but also illegal.

And Max complained about that move when Rosberg did it to him a few years ago.

[dans79]

Much like Spain this year, Vettel crowding out Leclerc at T2, and Leclerc crowding out Gasly I think it was at T3. Its allowed at the start rightly or wrong. Not on lap 69 it shouldn't be allowed.

Like I mentioned earlier Charles did it to hulk last year in Japan.


Or Lewis on Nico in Austin 2014. I think their was even some light contact in this scenario but no one cared.


In both cases Neither Lewis or Charles was substantially ahead until the outside driver decided to back out of it under breaking because they knew they where driving into a vanishing wedge.

[Just_a_fan]

Max did not dive bomb Charles. Dive bombing is coming from several lengths, not from one or two.

[NathanOlder]

Much like Spain this year, Vettel crowding out Leclerc at T2, and Leclerc crowding out Gasly I think it was at T3. Its allowed at the start rightly or wrong. Not on lap 69 it shouldn't be allowed.

Like I mentioned earlier Charles did it to hulk last year in Japan.
https://youtu.be/cRTmuPOhaIA?t=225

Or Lewis on Nico in Austin 2014. I think their was even some light contact in this scenario but no one cared.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkte_CvXCaY

In both cases Neither Lewis or Charles was substantially ahead until the outside driver decided to back out of it under breaking because they knew they where driving into a vanishing wedge.

Charles definitely deserved a penalty for that all day long. And Lewis is closer to borderline as he IS substantially ahead, but I could see why he would be penalised

[sosic2121]

Isn't squeezing someone to the apex that late (as Max was only alongside very late) moving around in the braking zone. I thought that wasn't allowed.

Scrap that. Max has been doing/getting away with that for years.

It's been an unspoken allowed move for a long time. In other words the drivers and stewards have always allowed a driver overtaking on the inside to squeeze the defending driver out. Caveats beings it has to be done in a way that doesn't endanger the defending driver, or cause an accident. You can literally see this almost every season.

Yes(although I don't agree with it), but this time it caused accident.