FIA-Ferrari PU Statement Controversy

[djos]

Is there a reason that voting has been removed from this topic?

Prolly to protect the Trolls from being ahnililated.

[RZS10]

Or to prevent them from stacking up positive votes for simply agreeing with each other without really adding anything useful to the discussion

[siskue2005]

Is there a reason that voting has been removed from this topic?

Prolly to protect the Trolls from being ahnililated.

The f1 moderators have reached a private 'settlement' with the trolls over the use of voting system
All others are shocked by f1 moderators and trolls private settlement

P.S: Just joking, please dont downvote me

[TAG]

Is there a reason that voting has been removed from this topic?

Ferrari and the FiA asked.

[LM10]

I know this is all fun and games and all that we are talking about it but seriously I feel like people are just trying to read what you want to hear from the lines given from the FIA announcement. So what now... if Ferrrari's pace is nowhere and people would point 'you see, told you so they were cheating'. Or if they suddenly drop their sandbags in Australia and people say 'look they still cheating, FIA clearly means Todt has been biased towards Ferrari and allowing them to cheat...' is there a version out that Ferrari isn't blamed for cheating?

There is no way from now on. After FIA’s statement, everyone will think that Ferrari cheats and the FIA protects them, IF they appear to still have a powerful PU. The reason obviously is that most people interpret the letter of the FIA as a proof of Ferrari having cheated.

[Unc1eM0nty]

Is there a limit to the power these PU's must deliver? So when Mercedes AMG was the most powerfull (we could see that on telemetry) did they cheat?

Yes, there's a limit to the thermal efficiency of the PU's, Mercedes are very near the practical limits so for Ferrari to leap frog them is evidence in itself imo they were cheating! You can only get so much power out of the mandated fuel flow limit.

So the moment any one makes more power than Mercedes AMG they are cheating. I get it... they are wizards!

Mercedes have never lost their advantage mid season though

[JPBD1990]

Article 2.5 of the technical rugulations allows the FIA to ban legal technical innovations that are deemed to add no value to F1. If it happens the team must publish details about such technology.
It's possible that the agreement between FIA and Ferrari has been done in order to prevent Ferrari from using such technology, but at the same time granting them the confidentiality neeed before filing a patent.

This, at this time (imo) is seeming the most plausible explanation TO ME. I think the reason for non-disclosure is because the technology doesn’t belong to Ferrari - my SUSPICION is that it is indeed their fuel (belonging to Shell) and is possibly patent pending. Shell may have legitimate commercial applications for such technology/additives that aren’t bound by fuel flow limits specific to F1.

Intriguiiiiiiinnnnngggggg

[djos]

Is there a reason that voting has been removed from this topic?

Prolly to protect the Trolls from being ahnililated.

The f1 moderators have reached a private 'settlement' with the trolls over the use of voting system
All others are shocked by f1 moderators and trolls private settlement

P.S: Just joking, please dont downvote me

[siskue2005]

I know this is all fun and games and all that we are talking about it but seriously I feel like people are just trying to read what you want to hear from the lines given from the FIA announcement. So what now... if Ferrrari's pace is nowhere and people would point 'you see, told you so they were cheating'. Or if they suddenly drop their sandbags in Australia and people say 'look they still cheating, FIA clearly means Todt has been biased towards Ferrari and allowing them to cheat...' is there a version out that Ferrari isn't blamed for cheating?

There is no way from now on. After FIA’s statement, everyone will think that Ferrari cheats and the FIA protects them, IF they appear to still have a powerful PU. The reason obviously is that most people interpret the letter of the FIA as a proof of Ferrari having cheated.

Most people? including the 7 other teams?
So whom should we go with? bunch of ferrari fans in an online anonymous f1 forum or the 7 actual f1 teams?

[LM10]

I know this is all fun and games and all that we are talking about it but seriously I feel like people are just trying to read what you want to hear from the lines given from the FIA announcement. So what now... if Ferrrari's pace is nowhere and people would point 'you see, told you so they were cheating'. Or if they suddenly drop their sandbags in Australia and people say 'look they still cheating, FIA clearly means Todt has been biased towards Ferrari and allowing them to cheat...' is there a version out that Ferrari isn't blamed for cheating?

There is no way from now on. After FIA’s statement, everyone will think that Ferrari cheats and the FIA protects them, IF they appear to still have a powerful PU. The reason obviously is that most people interpret the letter of the FIA as a proof of Ferrari having cheated.

Most people? including the 7 other teams?
So whom should we go with? bunch of ferrari fans in an online anonymous f1 forum or any the 7 actual f1 teams?

What are the teams? Aliens or people? Which part of my post is false in that regard? If I’m telling that most people interpret it like that, I don’t attack them for their opinion.

I don’t have a definitive opinion on that matter. The easiest way will be to just wait for the season to start and see how Ferrari performs.

[siskue2005]

There is no way from now on. After FIA’s statement, everyone will think that Ferrari cheats and the FIA protects them, IF they appear to still have a powerful PU. The reason obviously is that most people interpret the letter of the FIA as a proof of Ferrari having cheated.

Most people? including the 7 other teams?
So whom should we go with? bunch of ferrari fans in an online anonymous f1 forum or any the 7 actual f1 teams?

What are the teams? Aliens or people? Which part of my post is false in that regard? If I’m telling that most people interpret it like that, I don’t attack them for their opinion.

I don’t have a definitive opinion on that matter. The easiest way will be to just wait for the season to start and see how Ferrari performs.

Team is a Team, People are people; Team is not an alien, but an establishment.

What i was trying to say is, when the Seven F1 team out of 10 Teams....i will repeat Seven F1 team out of 10 Teams together give out a statement like that shows how many reputed people think that Ferrari did something naughty!
It is not anymore about a bunch of opinions put out by online people it has gone to next level of legitimacy..... it is no longer fans opinion or people's opinion, it is proper statement by teams, which cannot be denied by anyone. For them to come out like this means there HAS been something fishy going on.

[gshevlin]

The FIA clearly tried to sneak it out in a way that would reduce the level of initial publicity. However, that backfired, because of the incendiary content of the announcement. As soon as the teams and F1 fans read it, you can imagine most people going "What The......".
It is not a lovey-dovey "Nothing is amiss, we all agreed on this, and we will live happily ever after" announcement. The announcement, when you parse it, says "we suspected Ferrari of breaking the 2019 technical regulations, they refused to agree, so we have come to a compromise where Ferrari sort of pay a fine by supporting certain FIA activities, and we are sweeping this under the carpet. Business as usual, Bye".
They also issued it less than 2 weeks in advance of the Australian Grand Prix, which is at significant risk of cancellation. Ferrari, Alpha Tauri and Pirelli are all based in Italy, and Italy is a hotbed of the Coronavirus pandemic right now.
The bigger question: why issue the statement now? And why was there no response at all from Ferrari? (I have not seen or heard of any official comment by them).
There are several possible reasons that I can think of (NOTE - I am now speculating).
1. Somebody had the entire details of the incident and was about to leak them. The FIA issued the statement as a pre-emptive action, with all parties signing NDAs so that if any details leak, the parties have legal recourse against the leaker.
2. Ferrari was threatening to withdraw from flyaway races in 2020 because of the Coronavirus pandemic, and the FIA needed something with which to shock them to fall back in line.
3. There are significant disagreements still between the FIA, Liberty and Ferrari over the 2021 onwards commercial and technical contracts, and the FIA went public with this announcement to increase its leverage over Ferrari in the short term.

[gshevlin]

I would add that the statement is unusual, in that there has been no attempt made to minimize or obfuscate the fact that something significant happened to bring Ferrari into conflict with the FIA. The statement is totally obfuscatory when it comes to detail, but the story that the FIA investigated Ferrari, something untoward was found, and that Ferrari is having to make some form of recompense, is very clear. Almost too clear. Like the FIA wanted to embarrass Ferrari. They could have engaged in all manner of obfuscatory language, but when you lead with the money word "settlement", you immediately alert readers that somebody behaved incorrectly.

[gshevlin]

And a final comment: at the end of the day, Formula 1 is an extreme example of the old rule: Follow The Money.
The other F1 teams all have a price, and if some money can be found under a tree somewhere, and given to the teams as an unexpected windfall, the cynic in me believes that the teams will suddenly decide that they have other things that they want to talk about in public.

[siskue2005]

Getting serious now

According to Autobild Liberty Media is in support of the F1 teams that signed the letter

Also says that Alfa and Haas are unaffected since they didnt had access to that trick

Red Bull will apparently take legal action in any case since 20 million € are on the line for them.

Marko: “This time we joined the campaign initiated by Mercedes. In the future, however, we will think about how we get justice on our own.”
https://f1-insider.com/en/formula1/team ... d-ferrari/