In my opinion some people are upset, because the engine manufacturer, team, or driver they cheer for simply isn't good enough to beat Mercedes or Lewis on merit. Thus any time Mercedes or Lewis is less than perfect they feel the need to make a big deal about it.
Couldn't have another more cliche comment than this one. A car that is miles ahead, which allows the driver to make the worst of the mistakes, yet get out of it, makes it hardly surprising that the driver driving it would come out on top. Another driver, driving a lesser car manages to beat his subservient team mate driving the same dominant car, on merit, definitely makes it a far more worthy performance.
Sometimes people don't like hearing the truth!
I agree!dans79 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 06:43Sometimes people don't like hearing the truth!Moore77 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 06:41Couldn't have another more cliche comment than this one. A car that is miles ahead, which allows the driver to make the worst of the mistakes, yet get out of it, makes it hardly surprising that the driver driving it would come out on top. Another driver, driving a lesser car manages to beat his subservient team mate driving the same dominant car, on merit, definitely makes it a far more worthy performance.
Performance on softs differs from car to car. With Mercedes having so much downforce, can easily push that out of the window, but then they can nurse it too with such a big performance advantage. The only interesting thing is, if Hamilton and Bottas are 1-2 after turn 2, then how does that play out. Bottas might push Hamilton harder with those mediums and that might cause some worries.
Considering 2014 and 2018 are the only races in Sochi not to feature a safety car, and that Masi seems to have a compulsion for them this year, I'd say chances are high that it won't matter what tire people start on.
Racing point have exactly the same PU and they managed it.zibby43 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:30Had nothing to do with being flustered.ispano6 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:08Lewis got a penalty for driving too slowly in the pit lane during a race but both Leclerc and Vettel avoided penalties from driving too slow in quali for in lap and out lap last year. Leaving pit lane in quali is a first come first serve ordeal, and as long as the minimal average lap time is met there shouldn't be an issue, and in this case cars were parked waiting for the green. Mercedes could have put Ham front of the line but they didn't. Mercedes Boys could have easily done the same and tried to create a gap between the car in front. They could have "teamed up" with pink Mercedes and RedBull could have been left out all the same. Truth is AT weren't blocking anyone on a flyer and leaving pitlane exit from a red flag can't be timed as an enforcible out lap. It's a stretch to say RedBull had Alpha Tauri hold up the cars behind. Mercedes just didn't get things right and were flustered. It can happen, no one gets everything right always, even with all their brilliant engineers and strategists. Throw in some random chaos and you can get occasional brainfarts in logic.Diesel wrote: ↑26 Sep 2020, 22:02
It's not allowed on entry to the pitlane, I think Norris got investigated for doing it recently when the team was trying to double stop? I don't see how this was any different, it was a pretty blatant attempt to try and put the cars behind at risk of not making it over the line. There's nothing wrong with Kvyat wanting to create a gap, but he can't do that on the exit of the pit lane and impede all of the drivers behind him. It seems Masi was too busy deleting people's lap times to even notice this
Mercedes could not queue up in the pitlane because they can't start their engine with the MGU-K. The cars that queued up cannot sit there waiting with the PUs on without overheating. So they wait, and switch the PUs on with their MGU-Ks (like LEC did this season on track).
Not to mention, the tires get cold because they're sitting without the warmers on and they lose their temperature. So even if they were able to do MGU-K starts, they couldn't sit there with the mediums and make them work in the time left.
With the greatest of respect it’s understandable that you’re upset what with the red cars being rubbish but there’s no need to lash out at others for doing an amazing job.Moore77 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 06:41Couldn't have another more cliche comment than this one. A car that is miles ahead, which allows the driver to make the worst of the mistakes, yet get out of it, makes it hardly surprising that the driver driving it would come out on top. Another driver, driving a lesser car manages to beat his subservient team mate driving the same dominant car, on merit, definitely makes it a far more worthy performance.
Restomaniac wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:21Racing point have exactly the same PU and they managed it.zibby43 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:30Had nothing to do with being flustered.ispano6 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:08
Lewis got a penalty for driving too slowly in the pit lane during a race but both Leclerc and Vettel avoided penalties from driving too slow in quali for in lap and out lap last year. Leaving pit lane in quali is a first come first serve ordeal, and as long as the minimal average lap time is met there shouldn't be an issue, and in this case cars were parked waiting for the green. Mercedes could have put Ham front of the line but they didn't. Mercedes Boys could have easily done the same and tried to create a gap between the car in front. They could have "teamed up" with pink Mercedes and RedBull could have been left out all the same. Truth is AT weren't blocking anyone on a flyer and leaving pitlane exit from a red flag can't be timed as an enforcible out lap. It's a stretch to say RedBull had Alpha Tauri hold up the cars behind. Mercedes just didn't get things right and were flustered. It can happen, no one gets everything right always, even with all their brilliant engineers and strategists. Throw in some random chaos and you can get occasional brainfarts in logic.
Mercedes could not queue up in the pitlane because they can't start their engine with the MGU-K. The cars that queued up cannot sit there waiting with the PUs on without overheating. So they wait, and switch the PUs on with their MGU-Ks (like LEC did this season on track).
Not to mention, the tires get cold because they're sitting without the warmers on and they lose their temperature. So even if they were able to do MGU-K starts, they couldn't sit there with the mediums and make them work in the time left.
“It was a tough day,” said Stroll, with Perez having gone on to claim an impressive P4 for the team. “We were all set for the final few minutes of Q2 and raring to go after the red flag. Sadly, the engine was overheating while we were in the fast lane so we took the precaution of switching off the car.
Meanwhile, Racing Point CEO and Team Principal Otmar Szafnauer admitted that Stroll had been left in the pit lane queue for a lengthy period due to the team attempting to “second guess” when the red flag period would end – adding that the Canadian “deserved more” from his Saturday in Russia.
“We tried to second guess when the session would restart,” said Szafnauer. “Unfortunately, the power unit was overheating and we asked Lance to switch the car off. He deserved more from today, but he will be strong tomorrow, and at least he will get a free choice of tyres for the start of the race.”
Very good point. If a really early SC/VSC happens, you'd definitely expect Hamilton to jump, but it'll be interesting to see what the Medium-shod drivers do.
Performance does vary car-to-car, but as a general rule, the more downforce you have, the better you protect the tires, as you're not sliding around on them as much (which generates overheating).Moore77 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:10Performance on softs differs from car to car. With Mercedes having so much downforce, can easily push that out of the window, but then they can nurse it too with such a big performance advantage. The only interesting thing is, if Hamilton and Bottas are 1-2 after turn 2, then how does that play out. Bottas might push Hamilton harder with those mediums and that might cause some worries.
Er... no they didn’t. Strolls car overheated in the pit lane for this very reason, and had to be pushed back to his garage and Perez didn’t go outRestomaniac wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:21Racing point have exactly the same PU and they managed it.zibby43 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:30Had nothing to do with being flustered.ispano6 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:08
Lewis got a penalty for driving too slowly in the pit lane during a race but both Leclerc and Vettel avoided penalties from driving too slow in quali for in lap and out lap last year. Leaving pit lane in quali is a first come first serve ordeal, and as long as the minimal average lap time is met there shouldn't be an issue, and in this case cars were parked waiting for the green. Mercedes could have put Ham front of the line but they didn't. Mercedes Boys could have easily done the same and tried to create a gap between the car in front. They could have "teamed up" with pink Mercedes and RedBull could have been left out all the same. Truth is AT weren't blocking anyone on a flyer and leaving pitlane exit from a red flag can't be timed as an enforcible out lap. It's a stretch to say RedBull had Alpha Tauri hold up the cars behind. Mercedes just didn't get things right and were flustered. It can happen, no one gets everything right always, even with all their brilliant engineers and strategists. Throw in some random chaos and you can get occasional brainfarts in logic.
Mercedes could not queue up in the pitlane because they can't start their engine with the MGU-K. The cars that queued up cannot sit there waiting with the PUs on without overheating. So they wait, and switch the PUs on with their MGU-Ks (like LEC did this season on track).
Not to mention, the tires get cold because they're sitting without the warmers on and they lose their temperature. So even if they were able to do MGU-K starts, they couldn't sit there with the mediums and make them work in the time left.
dans79 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:28Restomaniac wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:21Racing point have exactly the same PU and they managed it.zibby43 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 00:30
Had nothing to do with being flustered.
Mercedes could not queue up in the pitlane because they can't start their engine with the MGU-K. The cars that queued up cannot sit there waiting with the PUs on without overheating. So they wait, and switch the PUs on with their MGU-Ks (like LEC did this season on track).
Not to mention, the tires get cold because they're sitting without the warmers on and they lose their temperature. So even if they were able to do MGU-K starts, they couldn't sit there with the mediums and make them work in the time left.
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... Z7Dsa.html
“It was a tough day,” said Stroll, with Perez having gone on to claim an impressive P4 for the team. “We were all set for the final few minutes of Q2 and raring to go after the red flag. Sadly, the engine was overheating while we were in the fast lane so we took the precaution of switching off the car.Meanwhile, Racing Point CEO and Team Principal Otmar Szafnauer admitted that Stroll had been left in the pit lane queue for a lengthy period due to the team attempting to “second guess” when the red flag period would end – adding that the Canadian “deserved more” from his Saturday in Russia.
“We tried to second guess when the session would restart,” said Szafnauer. “Unfortunately, the power unit was overheating and we asked Lance to switch the car off. He deserved more from today, but he will be strong tomorrow, and at least he will get a free choice of tyres for the start of the race.”
I was looking for those exact comments. https://www.racefans.net/2020/09/26/how ... -the-race/For teams with Renault, Honda or Ferrari power units, this isn’t a problem. They can pull up, stop their engines and restart them when needed using the electrical power from the MGU-K – as Charles Leclerc did when his car stopped during the Spanish Grand Prix.
The Mercedes power unit, however, doesn’t have this capability. “We couldn’t really send him out early because you need to switch off the car and then restart it on the MGU-K, which is something we can’t do,” Wolff confirmed.
Seriously?Restomaniac wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:27With the greatest of respect it’s understandable that you’re upset what with the red cars being rubbish but there’s no need to lash out at others for doing an amazing job.Moore77 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 06:41Couldn't have another more cliche comment than this one. A car that is miles ahead, which allows the driver to make the worst of the mistakes, yet get out of it, makes it hardly surprising that the driver driving it would come out on top. Another driver, driving a lesser car manages to beat his subservient team mate driving the same dominant car, on merit, definitely makes it a far more worthy performance.
Correct. That's the point. It's not so much about lack of downforce that is a problem for these Soft Tyres in Mercedes' case. It's just the excess of it as these Pirelli's were built for 2019 cars and W11 is a monster with the downforce. If there is pressure on Hamilton from behind and if he has to push, then they might go away faster. There was a reason why Mercedes' preferred strategy was to start with Mediums. But having seen how Hamilton manages tyres, I won't be surprised if he pulls it off and wins the race.zibby43 wrote: ↑27 Sep 2020, 07:30Performance does vary car-to-car, but as a general rule, the more downforce you have, the better you protect the tires, as you're not sliding around on them as much (which generates overheating).
Other factors do play a role, such as the nature of the circuit/corners, abrasiveness of the tarmac, and ambient/track temperatures. Even with loads of downforce, if you generate too much heat/energy and take them out of the window, you end up the same place that a car with insufficient downforce does: sliding.
