2020 Eifel Grand Prix - Nürburgring, October 9-11

[PlatinumZealot]

Fighting for second and third is only a three points difference. A blind man could see that Max will always be close to Bottas and ready to pounce once he drives the second fastest car. This is like Alonso in 2012. His mantra was "consistent podiums" and it nearly worked too. If the guy who is finishing second makes a mistake or has technical issues things can quicklt turn around.

[zibby43]

Fighting for second and third is only a three points difference. A blind man could see that Max will always be close to Bottas and ready to pounce once he drives the second fastest car. This is like Alonso in 2012. His mantra was "consistent podiums" and it nearly worked too. If the guy who is finishing second makes a mistake or has technical issues things can quicklt turn around.

Agreed.

[Sieper]

Calling that a strategy miscalculation is just flat-out hilarious.

It was a tire/track debris problem. And Verstappen was almost bitten by it too, considering his tire was riddled with cuts.

And his stop in that race was no strategy masterstroke. He was about 15 years behind, and had the time/space.

However way you try to turn it. Point 1 it was not a DNF, he finished. Point 2 it was not a technical failure he could do nothing for (like todays issue that caused him to retire actually was) it was either bad luck due to debris or just running out of tire. Which is likely to true reason, Lewis had the exact same issue. But in his last lap. You cannot and mustnot try to sell it as a DNF. Bottas has had one DNF this season to which he was innocent. Max 3.

That’s why I said DNF/non-top 10 classification.

PU failures and tire failures go in the same category for me - a combination of bad luck and unreliability.

It was lucky for Bottas to even get to P11 that day, but P11 or DNF doesn’t matter. The results are the same - 0 points. And whether it be via engine software or track debris, it’s not the driver’s fault.

We don’t have to do mental gymnastics to pump up Max here. I agree on one thing, he has 1 more unlucky outing than Bottas this year. 3 to 2.

Then we don’t agree at all as it is 3 to 1 in my opinion and I don’t appreciate you trying to play me off as a fool with quotes like hilarious. Don’t do that. I never do that to you neither. Lewis had his tire delaminate in Silverstone in the exact same way as Bottas. Both on the inside shoulder. Did Lewis then run over the same debris in the same way, but a few laps later? They just overestimated the tire life or had a set up that just a tad to agressive and paid the price with Bottas. It never happened since For Mercedes and we ran over a lot of debris since.

[Just_a_fan]

Wow, when was the last time Mercedes had a reliability / PU failure?

Malaysia 2016?

[PlatinumZealot]

Performance wise, count how many times Max has qualified in front and how many times Max has outpaced Bottas to get a proper picture. I personally do not consider Bottas to be underperforming or Max to be overperming by any exceptional amounts.

[Sieper]

Performance wise, count how many times Max has qualified in front and how many times Max has outpaced Bottas to get a proper picture. I personally do not consider Bottas to be underperforming or Max to be overperming by any exceptional amounts.

Same with Lewis, he also has much better race pace than Bottas. Max could (just) keep up with Bottas out in front but after the pit stop (and Bottas retiring) Lewis was always, like 2, 3? Tenths faster each lap. Even more after a restart but there he has DAS for a tire heat advantage. Lewis also pushed Bottas into the mistake, his front tires were graining. Lewis also said he could see it himself in the post race interview. Just due to superior pace (keeping the tires alive by better handling skills).

[LM10]

In today's race we've seen once again that it's a Lewis Hamilton championship. And it's been like that from the beginning. Bottas is a solid qualifier, but he sadly and clearly lacks race pace. His team mate doesn't even need to go to anywhere near his limits to outperform him. If someone claims the opposite, it's just a lie. Lewis is basically walking to the title.
And since Mercedes is way too strong this season, Max can't challenge Lewis either. It's amazing enough for him to constantly keep pace with the Mercedes.

Hulk has done a very good job today and also Leclerc had a strong race overall.

[Just_a_fan]

Question: Drivers are complaining about safety car being too slow, more or less each time it is on track. Why FIA don't want to change the car to a bit faster? I know that this is "safety" car so it can't be too fast, but maybe something just by 5-10s faster on lap than currently used Mercedes could be better?

The safety car is properly fast, for a road car. F1 cars are so fast that the safety car is pedestrian.

Want to know how it feels? Drive along a motorway/autobahn at decent speed. Then take an exit on to a normal road. How does it feel? Slow, right?

[Big Tea]

In today's race we've seen once again that it's a Lewis Hamilton championship. And it's been like that from the beginning. Bottas is a solid qualifier, but he sadly and clearly lacks race pace. His team mate doesn't even need to go to anywhere near his limits to outperform him. If someone claims the opposite, it's just a lie. Lewis is basically walking to the title.
And since Mercedes is way too strong this season, Max can't challenge Lewis either. It's amazing enough for him to constantly keep pace with the Mercedes.

Hulk has done a very good job today and also Leclerc had a strong race overall.

Its not race pace Bottas lacks, he always loses out with a mistake. Again, he did a huge lock up which spoiled his line and spoiled his tyres for a fight back. Yes, the engine fail was not his fault, but he was beaten by then.

1%, but Hamilton only needs 1%. If just about any other driver was in Hamilton's car I think Bottas would be in the fight all year, but how many mistakes does Hamilton make when it counts?

[i70q7m7ghw]

Question: Drivers are complaining about safety car being too slow, more or less each time it is on track. Why FIA don't want to change the car to a bit faster? I know that this is "safety" car so it can't be too fast, but maybe something just by 5-10s faster on lap than currently used Mercedes could be better?

The safety car is properly fast, for a road car. F1 cars are so fast that the safety car is pedestrian.

Want to know how it feels? Drive along a motorway/autobahn at decent speed. Then take an exit on to a normal road. How does it feel? Slow, right?

He's probably asking why isn't the safety car something faster i.e. some sort of purpose built race car that has downforce etc. At one point they were talking about using a single seater of some kind...

My question is, why wasn't the crane that Lando parked next to used to hoist the car off the track under a VSC? They didn't even need to bring the crane on track, could have just extended it over the barrier.

[Sieper]

In these cold circumstances the safety car speed deficit is indeed a problem. Especially the 2 front runners (who were out by a minute) lost so much heat in their tires. Then the restart and everybody fighting on cold tires is waiting for a terrible crash to happen. VSC or indeed speedier SC would have been better. But speedier SC might defeat its purpose.

[Big Tea]

Question: Drivers are complaining about safety car being too slow, more or less each time it is on track. Why FIA don't want to change the car to a bit faster? I know that this is "safety" car so it can't be too fast, but maybe something just by 5-10s faster on lap than currently used Mercedes could be better?

The safety car is properly fast, for a road car. F1 cars are so fast that the safety car is pedestrian.

Want to know how it feels? Drive along a motorway/autobahn at decent speed. Then take an exit on to a normal road. How does it feel? Slow, right?

He's probably asking why isn't the safety car something faster i.e. some sort of purpose built race car that has downforce etc. At one point they were talking about using a single seater of some kind...

My question is, why wasn't the crane that Lando parked next to used to hoist the car off the track under a VSC? They didn't even need to bring the crane on track, could have just extended it over the barrier.

I know it sounds easy when I say it from here, but (as last week) there was a gap in the barrier the car could be wheeled through if it was 'car sized'.

It seems the tracks were built with gaps to get the car through, but cars have grown and the gaps have not.

Lando looked for the board and drove to it. Is it not stupid to have a 'stop here' sign and no way to bet behind the barrier? Time for a track regs examination?

[Just_a_fan]

My question is, why wasn't the crane that Lando parked next to used to hoist the car off the track under a VSC? They didn't even need to bring the crane on track, could have just extended it over the barrier.

Oh that's easy. It's all about "the show". Throwing a safety car for that was all about manufacturing a sprint to the end.

Could have been done with a VSC. Could have been done with yellows to be honest.

[Sieper]

Powered pullback cables and skids for under the rear tires at these stations?

[Big Tea]

Powered pullback cables and skids for under the rear tires at these stations?

Even easier if there is a gap positioned for a freewheeling car to drive through.

They are not all going to be able to, but as they say 'Every little helps'