No More Grid Girls - replaced by Grid Kids

[NathanOlder]

Football clubs in england have started to say we wont ditch our cheer leaders, so they obviously have some similarities as they wouldn't feel the need to come out and say that.

And dancing is not to impress people looking ??

[Phil]

However, I think the damage done by the further objectification of women is far greater than the loss they've suffered. Ultimately, I believe that we should be trying to build a society that moves beyond appreciating women purely for looks alone. It's called progress. People are constantly having to change their profession as progress moves forwards.

IMO, that "progress" is a very dangerous pandoras box. We may be simply discussing "grid girls" here, but your post (and the reasons given by Liberty Media) hint that this discussion goes a lot further than that.

"building a society that moves beyond appreciating women purely for looks alone"...

Where does it start and where does this "progress" end? By the end of it, we might as well ban anything that means diversification. Anything that uses women to sell products based on their "looks" is no better than what these grid girls embody. Ban them? What about clothes that make us men look at women as objects. Ban them too? Why not? Anything that mutes the senses right, all in the name of progress.

Would you be in favour of banning fast cars or motorsports too on the basis that they encourage speeding all in the name of progress? You may not think it's relevant, but if you can say women are being objectified through the use of grid girls, then who would be wrong to say that speeding could not be encouraged by watching motorsports?

Have you seen the movie Equilibrium (2002)?

[McHonda]

Football clubs in england have started to say we wont ditch our cheer leaders, so they obviously have some similarities as they wouldn't feel the need to come out and say that.

And dancing is not to impress people looking ??

They only have to come out and say it because of people misunderstanding what's going on the exact same way you are with the dancers at the darts.

Of course it is. It also takes talent and appeals to both sexes as evidenced by it's popularity on talent shows.

[jz11]

The survey was done by Yougov. Not Liberty. Yougov took no action to remove grid girls. They are an independent survey group, dude.

I can't even...

the survey might have been done by Shaolin Monks for all I care, it still doesn't change the fact that they asked the "wrong" question, because the result of the poll will tell you with any degree of certainty absolutely nothing about whether that action of dropping the grid girls will increase the fan or viewership base of the sport, but it will give the F1M board some support for their actions, and then there are media relations departments in such companies, who may have been asked to get peoples opinion on the boards actions, and guess who they turn to is such cases

here is a question for you bonjon1979 - do you support free and uninfluenced career choice for women? and I will guess the answer - yes
so here is another question, why did you just support the possible reduction freedom of their choice? let me explain - F1 dropped the grid girls, which led to reduced demand for models at model agencies, which will lead to reduced income to the employed work force - there is no dispute about it, it exactly what happened

so the thing is not really about freedom for women to choose what they want to do, you simply want to have an effect on what you think is appropriate for them to do

You have to weigh up the two things. Yes, a tiny minority of women may lose a single weekends work throughout the year. However, I think the damage done by the further objectification of women is far greater than the loss they've suffered. Ultimately, I believe that we should be trying to build a society that moves beyond appreciating women purely for looks alone. It's called progress. People are constantly having to change their profession as progress moves forwards. Should we have banned the computer to protect the jobs of short-hand typists?

I don't have to do anything, since I think this is a non-issue for the reasons I said in few previous posts.

All I can say is that you people (I mean the SJW types thinking this IS an issue) will not stop until the f1 will become purely electric (I can even give you suggestions for future poll questions that will 100% justify this), all cars will be painted gray, drive on a gray colored asphalt, and we will watch it on our gray colored tvs sitting in gray colored rooms on gray colored sofas, because otherwise someone may become offended, and we for sure cannot have that.

p.s. I forgot to say that winners and places will be gone too from competition, because you can't have points, you would be appreciating driver skill on their points, such an unequality...

[Phil]

I feel the dangerous precedent here is that some are trying to decide in the name of “society” what is best for everyone, not by encouraging diversification, but by discouraging it.

I know many women who are happy to be seen as “objects” and make a living from that. In whos right is it for us to decide what is right for them as long as there is a market for it and no ethical bounderies are being broken? Is it in our responsibility as a society to protect them from themselves, for their own good and call that “progress”?

The biggest flaw here is that Liberty Media opened themselves to this line of scrutiny. They could have just dropped the grid girls, no reasons given and we wouldnt even be talking about this.

[dans79]

I feel the dangerous precedent here is that some are trying to decide in the name of “society” what is best for everyone, not by encouraging diversification, but by discouraging it.

It's Liberty's right to decide what they want their brand to be associated with, they own it! If they haven't broken any laws, then no one can do anything about it, period end of story.

[roon]

Excellent post Phil. Over reacting to an over sensitive minority is exactly how it is. And the majority lose out because of it.

Now, hold on. I speak for the majority around here. And I say they say they don't feel like they're losing out.

I feel the dangerous precedent here is that some are trying to decide in the name of “society” what is best for everyone, not by encouraging diversification, but by discouraging it. I know many women who are happy to be seen as “objects” and make a living from that. In whos right is it for us to decide what is right for them as long as there is a market for it and no ethical bounderies are being broken? Is it in our responsibility as a society to protect them from themselves, for their own good and call that “progress”?

You speak of a form of libertarian/liberal social control, not terribly different from others. Concepts of happiness and consent are easily subverted by sufficiently intelligent and unscrupulous people. They are not a path toward progress, egalitarianism, or freedom.

The biggest flaw here is that Liberty Media opened themselves to this line of scrutiny. They could have just dropped the grid girls, no reasons given and we wouldnt even be talking about this.

Controversy sells.

[McHonda]

That last part of Phil's post I agree wholeheartedly with. I'd also not have mentioned social norms in their statement,the brand reasons are more than enough. WEC and FE needed no fanfare and fuss to make their changes.

And no-one cared in return.

[NathanOlder]

My bad roon, I assumed the majority were happy for the models to be there and add a little glamour to the grid while the cars are not racing.

[roon]

I'll confirm with the majority later today, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.

[CBeck113]

I still think there could be Grid Girls this season, just not organized by F1, but set by the teams. Then everyone's happy and the ridiculous discussion, while one of the few that hasn't gone totally to the gutter, can be put to rest. Although I must admit that the differences in "opinion" blur by many into "this is the only right because I see it so". F*ck you for that social media.

[TAG]

a serious point here guys, there's an aspect to grid girls that I will miss. that's each country being able to put their nationality and flavor for lack of a better word, where it only adds to the "show" aspect of what the sport is trying to promote itself as.









Some images, that have been pretty typical of what we get in F1 as far as grid girls are concerned. In none of these is there anything more sexualized that what you'd get in your 200 commercials we in America would be exposed to during a race. In every single one of these examples, you know the GP just by what the grid girls are wearing. IMO, this isn't just a swing and a miss for Liberty, but it's a swing as a problem that doesn't exist.

[NathanOlder]

Loved the outfits the Austrian Women used.

[Manoah2u]

i really liked the malaysian grid girls. looked absolutely stunning.

[strad]

Have you been to a beach lately?
Maybe we should revert back to this?
Smokey” Buchanan from the West Palm Beach police force, measuring the bathing suit of Betty Fringle on Palm Beach, to ensure that it conforms with regulations introduced by the beach censors. .

Washington policeman Bill Norton measuring the distance between knee and suit at the Tidal Basin bathing beach after Col. Sherrill, Superintendent of Public Buildings and Grounds, issued an order that suits not be over six inches above the knee.
Obviously some of you think you should have the power to decide what's decent and what's not.
Gird girls are bad? Start a petition to ban the Victorias Secret fashion show.
God spare me from do-gooders.
I can show you pictures back to the early 1900s where the women are really push the conventional norms to attract men.
Are you against anything that casts women in a sexual light even when it's clearly what those women want?
IF those gird girls objected to being "objectified they would not fight to get to get the job.
Show me a time where women have not used their beauty and bodies to attract men.