2016 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, Fri 01 – Sun 03 Jul 2016

[Shooty81]

So i overlayed all the relevant frames from the replay

http://i.imgur.com/cLAE0W6.png

Green Line: ideal racing line

Red Line: the one Lewis wanted to take

Blue Line: the one Rosberg wanted to take (judging by his trajectory and him not turning in until the moment marked with the blue X - that's where he reacted to Lewis turning in)

Light Blue Line: Rosberg ended up on it after colliding with Lewis (marked with red)

Pink Line: Lewis ended up on it

marked with yellow-ish is the room Rosberg was left by Lewis, who approaching the corner was in front.

As i see it Lewis went on a line that is the 'ideal' line just further to the outside or 'later' if you will - Rosberg (as he admitted in his FB vlog) just wanted to go straight and turn in at the last possible moment ... does anyone remember the Rossi - Marquez incident last year in MotoGP ? It was very similar.

This post deserves more recognition, if only to highlight just how much intention Nico had of totally blocking Lewis.

There is squeezing on the exit,of a turn. Then there is forcing someone to actually make a turn off track.

With the trajectory Rosberg had, Lewis wouldve had to stop his car on track and literally wait there till Rosberg finally decided to complete the turn, which he barely managed to do while barely moving even after the shunt turned him in the right direction.

Exactly the same thing that Hamilton did in Austin last year or Montreal this year.

[turbof1]

My mistake was forgetting that race threads are incapable of nuance.

Oops.

I get your point. We disagree on the racing details, but effectively you should not be attempting any form of squeezing in the first place on your team mate. Trying to squeeze by taking the racing line can just as well lead to a crash. If I really had to draw a line in the sand, I would do it like described in my previous comments. But really trying to do this at all is just madness. Rosberg is doing this only because Hamilton squeezed out Rosberg in the past. It's what you get when you have 2 drivers having zero respect for one another. It's also why I laugh at Toto's threat with team orders: like they'll ever follow those.

[bhall II]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

[bhall II]

Still doesn't make it acceptable to make racist remarks.

https://englishhelponline.me/2011/02/27 ... in-spades/

[turbof1]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

Agreed. Just blaming Rosberg is denying the underlying issue. It's heartless racing between those 2 basically.

[Just_a_fan]

Indeed, if it was the other way round, Hamilton would have followed Rosberg on the inside and squeezed him to the outside at the exit, staying on the racing line. Rosberg lacks control in moments like these.

That is what i tried to say, Rosberg lacks finesse that Hamilton has in spades

Its buckets , not spades you *****

I suggest you learn English before you call him out. The phrase "to have [something] in spades" is a well known idiom. His use of it here is correct.

[bonjon1979]

Really confused about people's reaction to this. What rosberg did was fire up the inside of a car that was 3/4s of a length ahead. That gap was always going to close. If they'd been side by side then rosberg could've hung him out to dry on the outside. As it was, rosberg knew that the corner was gone and drove straight into a gap that was always going to close. I don't blame rosberg though, he's trying to win the wdc. Merc are the ones who need to take responsibility. How on earth could they let Nico take track position? They knew the potential problems that could create and they should've pitted Hamilton when rosberg was still 25 seconds behind. It was criminal on their part to risk hamiltons win by allowing rosberg ahead by strategy. When I say hamiltons win, I just mean that he got pole, lead the race, made his tyres last to have best position ahead of the ferraris and merc implemented a strategy that allowed rosberg to gain 14 seconds and overtake him. Toto needs to take responsibility and people need to stop blaming Nico

[Just_a_fan]

That's not what I said.

Rosberg did not turn into the apex at the point he should have. You could basically state he drove right past it. He did not turn away from it, he just did not made an attempt to turn in at the normal moment.

I get the feeling that Rosberg's intention was to prevent Hamilton doing his usual cut back type attack. If Rosberg had taken the usual line Hamilton would have been able to get his car straighter and on the power a little earlier. By holding his line, Rosberg tried to prevent that.

That's my generous view of it. My initial view of the incident was that Rosberg basically drove at Hamilton and expected him to avoid the collision.

Rosberg is trying to do, on entry, what is usually done on exit. On exit you take the line and the guy in the outside has a choice. This is standard racing in all formula and car types. Trying to prevent the cut back by driving at your opponent isn't.

[turbof1]

I removed some posts. Unless pointed at the colors of the cards, I don't see how one can play the card of racism or sarcasm when talking about "having something in spades". If you feel calling it racism, you really have not aced that idiom.

[henry]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

Agreed. Just blaming Rosberg is denying the underlying issue. It's heartless racing between those 2 basically.

It's not heartless it's irresponsible.

They both had an opportunity to avoid this and neither did. It was the same in Barcelona. Rosberg precipitated an opportunity to collide and Hamilton took it in both cases. In this race Sainz chopped Perez in a similar fashion to Rosberg's Barcelona chop and Perez avoided leaving the road. They touched tyres but no more.

Were I Mercedes management I'd be furious with them both. They have been provided with a car of unequaled dominance and whenever they get close together they run each other off the road at best and collide if one doesn't "chicken", risking Mercedes' quest for the dominance that the other 1000 employees deserve.

I know more responsible 6 year olds.

[NathanOlder]

Cool

So onwards to Silverstone, cant wait. Plus Lewis normally goes well at home.

[turbof1]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

Agreed. Just blaming Rosberg is denying the underlying issue. It's heartless racing between those 2 basically.

It's not heartless it's irresponsible.

They both had an opportunity to avoid this and neither did. It was the same in Barcelona. Rosberg precipitated an opportunity to collide and Hamilton took it in both cases. In this race Sainz chopped Perez in a similar fashion to Rosberg's Barcelona chop and Perez avoided leaving the road. They touched tyres but no more.

Were I Mercedes management I'd be furious with them both. They have been provided with a car of unequaled dominance and whenever they get close together they run each other off the road at best and collide if one doesn't "chicken", risking Mercedes' quest for the dominance that the other 1000 employees deserve.

I know more responsible 6 year olds.

I think heartless and irresponsible go hand in hand here. I can understand you'd do this to a driver from a different team, but you are outright risking big points for your team when it involves your teammate. Wolf was absolutely right this is disrespectful towards the 1,500 employees of the team.

[Dazed1]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

Agreed. Just blaming Rosberg is denying the underlying issue. It's heartless racing between those 2 basically.

Nico desperately wants a WDC. Earlier in the season I thought he had made some Zen transformation and was a better driver than he had been and might be on his way to "earning" one. Now I suspect he was just riding the wave of Lewis' bad luck and feeling no pressure. Today he showed that he still errs when pushed and is willing to do damage to get his way.
In any case, if he could show a little patience, Lewis' mysterious equipment issues this year will probably get Nico there anyway.

[GrandAxe]

I clarified that to say I'm neither defending Rosberg nor condemning Hamilton. --- happens.

Look through the early pages of this thread where people wanted Rosberg's head on a plate. I just don't think it was that serious is all.

Agreed. Just blaming Rosberg is denying the underlying issue. It's heartless racing between those 2 basically.

It's not heartless it's irresponsible.

They both had an opportunity to avoid this and neither did. It was the same in Barcelona. Rosberg precipitated an opportunity to collide and Hamilton took it in both cases. In this race Sainz chopped Perez in a similar fashion to Rosberg's Barcelona chop and Perez avoided leaving the road. They touched tyres but no more.

Were I Mercedes management I'd be furious with them both. They have been provided with a car of unequaled dominance and whenever they get close together they run each other off the road at best and collide if one doesn't "chicken", risking Mercedes' quest for the dominance that the other 1000 employees deserve.

I know more responsible 6 year olds.

Three things:

1. Merc gave Nico an unfair advantage through strategy, so it is not in their place to be furious after they had been so irresponsible. There is nothing worse for any teams performance/cohesion than for its management to appear to be unfair to one or more members.

2. Nico tried to "squeeze" a car that was already ahead. There's only one way that could have ended - a crash.

3. There is no obvious way Lewis could have avoided a T-bone given his and Nico's trajectories, speeds and the geometry of the corner.

[Just_a_fan]

Wolf was absolutely right this is disrespectful towards the 1,500 employees of the team.

Perhaps he should get Rosberg some lessons in wheel-to-wheel racing then. There is no doubting Rosberg's speed or his work ethic. The problem is that he is not a natural close-in racer. Hamilton, like Alonso, Vettel etc, seems to have a better feel for what he can and can't do in close company on track.

Maybe he just lacks that little extra bit of arrogance that the best seem to have behind the wheel. He seems to be trying to prove he's good where others just know. When he lets his natural speed run, he's all but unstoppable. He needs to concentrate on that, forget about Hamilton and just make sure he qualifies ahead, starts better and claims the tyre strategies.