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Pirelli's motorsport director Paul Hembery has repeated at Korea that F1's sole tyre suppliers need to have more relevant tyre testing if it is to develop solid and reliable tyres for the 2014 season.
I think that is impossible. Pirelli would effectively have to bring double the amount of tyres to allow a midweekend switch to the old ones. If Pirelli brings the new tyres along, the teams will be stuck with it for the rest of the weekend.Ferrari2183 wrote:Not even that. The old tyres could actually be raced in Canada if they're not happy with the new ones. Could be that the new tyres will only be run in 1 of the FP'sturbof1 wrote:From what I get out of this article:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107618
is that we will see new tyres in Canada. Force India wants to try them out first, before changes are final. So the possibility is there that we have new tyres in Canada, only to be changed back after that race.
It's better than racing on a tyre that everybody is not happy with. They could also shift the change back to Silverstone as initially intended and give the teams a run on it in Canada as they did with the experimental hard in Spain.turbof1 wrote:I think that is impossible. Pirelli would effectively have to bring double the amount of tyres to allow a midweekend switch to the old ones. If Pirelli brings the new tyres along, the teams will be stuck with it for the rest of the weekend.Ferrari2183 wrote:Not even that. The old tyres could actually be raced in Canada if they're not happy with the new ones. Could be that the new tyres will only be run in 1 of the FP'sturbof1 wrote:From what I get out of this article:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107618
is that we will see new tyres in Canada. Force India wants to try them out first, before changes are final. So the possibility is there that we have new tyres in Canada, only to be changed back after that race.
I think you will find that teams do actually test the tyres because it is not just a compound tweak. All it takes is a couple of constant speed runs to ascertain its aero effect and further few pounding the circuit checking it's working range.turbof1 wrote:Of course it is better, but like I said it's impossible to bring double the amount along. They will probably start producing the tyres next week, so it will be tight already to get them finished and transported to canada in time. There is no time to build and transport another full gp weekend of tyres. Bringing a prototype along might just make the cut, but that would be useless towards Silverstone, a complete different circuit. Teams wouldn't bother running the prototype anyway, just like in Spain.
"My view would be that we run with what we have, the 2013 tyres, and if Pirelli can get a set of test tyres that they want to look at in the meantime, then we should test them and evaluate them," Fernley told AUTOSPORT.
Pirelli have pretty much lost all credibility for making tyres. Every failure has an excuse that's not able to be foreseen by them in advance because of one reason or another - it's someone else's fault. So they've apparently been forced to make tyres that delaminate, that last 4 laps, that allow a car to be supremely fast over one lap and might slow over the next 20, while every failure has been due to debris and their lack of understanding rubber on road surfaces on different temperature conditions.lebesset wrote:Neno wrote:Tyers must be very conservative, "Bridgestone like" at least for first season under new regulations. Teams will already have full hands of understanding new cars, new rules, new loop-holes as new engines, something completly new, if you throw them today's unpredictable, small window and short lasting Pirelli tyers, teams wont understand either cars or tires... Season could become like 2009 with Brawn and Button winning...turbof1 wrote:It's for a single year. It will be already quite unpredictable with so many new rules.
if you read the statements on the FIA press conference pirelli have already stated that , if still the supplier in 2014 , they will provide more conservative tyres as the cars are unknown and the teams will have enough problems to solve !
tyres will not be needed to spice up the racing , the new formula will do that ...unless a team comes up with the killer design of course !
I dunno. But this photo of Paul Hembry has appeared lately in several press reports:What the heck have they been doing in that lab?
Maybe Pirelli are looking to the LORD for answers ?Jersey Tom wrote:And if you can't ensure sufficient durability / safety margin from your in house lab testing for something like a big, fundamental construction change of going from aramid to steel belts... then you just don't to it.
Why in the world do you think that todays aero package precludes a hard compound????And you obv dont know we cant compare cars of the 80s and early 90s with now, if we had that aero now we could do hard tires but we dont.
Sam Collins of Racecar Engineering – came up with an interesting theory in the Monaco paddock: Pirelli are being manoeuvred out of Formula One to make way for Korean tyre suppliers Hankook.
The idea certainly has basis in fact. Pirelli are currently without an F1 contract for 2014 onwards, and the Italian tyre manufacturer is running out of time. Speaking to the media before the start of the season, Pirelli motorsport director Paul Hembery refused to set a specific deadline, but said that his company would need a contract by late June/early July if they were going to be able to create 2014 rubber for the sport.
That means that unless Pirelli have a contract signed in around six weeks’ time, we’re very unlikely to see them in the sport next year.
So where does Hankook fit in to all of this? Collins discovered a 2011 interview with Cho Hyun-bum, the chief financial officer of Hankook, in which the CFO said that Hankook’s move into DTM was a first step on the road to getting the F1 tyre contract in 2014. “We are keen to do it and DTM is a logical stepping stone,” he said at the time.
According to Cho, in 2010 Bernie Ecclestone approached Hankook about the F1 tyre supply contract. The F1 supremo was looking to get more Asian companies involved in a sport rapidly moving eastward, and Hankook were keen to get involved. But the stumbling block was the eight-month timeframe. As a company with no experience of racing rubber, eight months was not enough time to get the job done well.
Which is why the Koreans moved into DTM, having promised Ecclestone that they would be in a position to supply him with F1 rubber in 2014.
Well, 2014 is fast-approaching, as is Pirelli’s summer deadline. Pirelli are keen to remain involved in Formula One (at the moment – the board could always change their minds in light of the recent barrage of criticism and bad publicity); the teams have all said they’d be happy to continue with Pirelli; the FIA have no bones to pick with the Italian tyre manufacturer.
But the delays to a new contract continue. Collins’ theory is that the delays are coming from Prince’s Gate with a view to setting up Hankook as F1’s next exclusive tyre supplier, and I am inclined to agree with him.
Whitmarsh said Formula One had "badly mismanaged" the introduction of the new V6 turbo engine regulations for 2014.
"What is frightening is that we have adopted important new engine regulations," he said. "They are the right thing to do in many regards. They are technologically interesting and relevant to society. But F1 badly mismanaged the cost of the development and supply of those new power plants. We allowed the engineers to be unfettered in dreaming up the regulations, which means teams are now facing big bills. We got costs down to £10m and now we are talking about double that. That is with all the other cost challenges we have. In addition, under the new agreement, the teams will to pay Pirelli $105m over the seven years."
Talks between Pirelli and the teams about the details of any new deal for next year have stalled, leaving Pirelli frustrated and warning that it will soon be impossible to comply with the demands of any contract for 2014.
It is believed that Pirelli has agreed a commercial deal with F1 ringmaster Bernie Ecclestone, but that general deal requires the support of agreements between Pirelli and the teams and also the ruling body, the International Motoring Federation (FIA). Some teams are understood to be reluctant to reach any agreement with Pirelli.
Cause todays aero makes it harder to pass and with todays cars as in 2013 being so close it will be static.strad wrote:Why in the world do you think that todays aero package precludes a hard compound????And you obv dont know we cant compare cars of the 80s and early 90s with now, if we had that aero now we could do hard tires but we dont.
Losing downforce when following another car isn't a recent phenomena. It's been a factor since wings were first introduced.Huntresa wrote:Cause todays aero makes it harder to pass and with todays cars as in 2013 being so close it will be static.strad wrote:Why in the world do you think that todays aero package precludes a hard compound????And you obv dont know we cant compare cars of the 80s and early 90s with now, if we had that aero now we could do hard tires but we dont.
And the introduction of DRS since 2010 will do nothing to cure those trains....Huntresa wrote:Cause todays aero makes it harder to pass and with todays cars as in 2013 being so close it will be static.strad wrote:Why in the world do you think that todays aero package precludes a hard compound????And you obv dont know we cant compare cars of the 80s and early 90s with now, if we had that aero now we could do hard tires but we dont.