Pirelli 2013

[Javert]

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/184758/1/p ... _2013.html

Tyre manufacturer Pirelli has revealed that it intends to change almost all the compounds in its F1 tyre line-up for 2013 in an attempt to reduce criticism of the current narrow working range.

..
"This year, in general we have averaged one pit-stop less per car," he said. "If that trend carries on then we would soon be back to one stop at every race, so we need to do something to give it that extra challenge," he added, saying that next year Pirelli would likely offer some more "aggressive compounds" to the teams to try out.
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[raymondu999]

I think a large part of the inability of cars to really get their tyres switched on is the fixed weight distribution - had they not had that kept for this year, the grid IMO would be a lot more "normal" with less surprise results.

[DaveW]

I think a large part of the inability of cars to really get their tyres switched on is the fixed weight distribution.

That would appear to be the case, mechanically. Teams might improve matters by set-up changes, apparently, but perhaps vehicles have been developed to preclude this. Also, I am sure that the regulation preventing set-up changes after the start of qualifying isn't exactly helpful.

[ESPImperium]

Id like to see three things;

First the Pirelli guys need to get a bit more aggressive on tyres, however only more aggressive by say 10Km a set less a set as at presently they aim for 100Km a stint. Id like to see this becomne to arround the 90Km per stint. The teams will optomise thrugh the season to reduce their tyre wear. At the start of the season it should be arround 3 stops a race with the end being toward the 2 stopper aera. However id make the Pirellis easier to hit the cliff as well, meaning that a driver will have to nurse the the tyres alot more in the early stages.

Secondly, id like to see it that the FIA and Pirelli allocate 5 sets of tyres to each car for Quali and the race, 3 option sets and 2 prime. One option set is set aside for cars to use in a Q3 that should be like the 2005 Quali rules where each driver has to go and do a single lap in a 5 minuite session. It will mean that all the Q3 guys will have burnt all but one set of prime tyres before the race, meaning that the tyre strategy will be even more marjinal for the Q3 guys. Its almost a handicap for success in Quali. The set that was not used for the non Q3 guys gets given back to the team in order to give them a alternitive strategy for the race. The set the Q3 guys use must be taken to the race start.

Thirdly, ill look at the present weight regs:

ARTICLE 4 : WEIGHT

4.1 Minimum weight :
The weight of the car must not be less than 640kg at all times during the Event.

If, when required for checking, a car is not already fitted with dry-weather tyres, it will be weighed on a set of dry-weather tyres selected by the FIA technical delegate.

4.2 Weight distribution :
For 2012 and 2013 only, the weight applied on the front and rear wheels must not be less than 291kg and 342kg respectively at all times during the qualifying practice session.

If, when required for checking, a car is not already fitted with dry-weather tyres, it will be weighed on a set of dry-weather tyres selected by the FIA technical delegate.

4.1 id change to 650Kg minimum weight.
4.2 id change to 290 Kg to 300Kg over the front wheels and 340Kg to 350Kg over the rear wheels.

That would mean that the teams if they had their car at the lowest ammounts over the wheels it would mean they would have 20Kg to play with in ballast, and im sure that would make alot more of a difference to the teams. Im only making a slmall 1 or two kilo difference to the present figures, but with the change of 4.1 it would really help the teams get on top of the tyres as much as they could.

However id also mandate a spec fuel tank as well that has to be 140KG with a 2.25Kg per 5Km fuel flow restrictor on it, whitch means there would be more of a need for cars to be fueled much higher than they presently are, but fuel sustem must have to supply at least 2 Kg per 5Km as well, so that would mean the teams would have the choice to fill up a little more and use that to push as well, whitch would affect tyre wear accordingly.

he rest of Article 4 id keep the same as it is at present:

4.3 Weight of tyres :
The weight limits specified in Articles 4.1 and 4.2 will be adjusted according to any differences (rounded up to the nearest 1kg) between the total set and individual axle set weights respectively of the 2010 and 2011 dry-weather tyres.

4.4 Ballast :
Ballast can be used provided it is secured in such a way that tools are required for its removal. It must be possible to fix seals if deemed necessary by the FIA technical delegate.

4.5 Adding during the race :
With the exception of compressed gases, no substance may be added to the car during the race. If it becomes necessary to replace any part of the car during the race, the new part must not weigh any more than the original part.

On other rules that affect tyres, id make it more lucritive for the FP1 driver if a team wish to run a Bottas/Clos/Ma/Van Der Garde or simmilar from previous years, in where the FP1 guy would get a set of the race drivers primes, but a FP1 driver would also get a set of options allocated to him as well. This would encourage the teams to give the FP1 guy a lot more running, instead of an average of 120Km he could get concievable 150 to 170Km out of a 90 minuite session. However with this id mandate it that each team has to have a FP1 driver for at least 10GP a year, work load split equally between both race drivers on this, so no Bottas in 15 FP1s in Sennas car.

[DaveW]

Here is an interesting article. A few extracts:

"Suddenly faced with understeer, Lewis wasn't able to diagnose the problem, referring to a loss of front downforce on the team radio."

"Hamilton's lap times tells the story. Lap 17 and 18 were 1m44.8s and 1m44.9s – then after the failure he went 1m46.1s, 1m46.6s, 1m47.0s and so on."

"Until the roll-bar failure Lewis was fighting for a place on the podium," said Whitmarsh. "He had an absolutely terrible car to drive, he had poor balance, he was absolutely destroying the tyres; in truth at that point I didn't think we'd get to the end of the race on the tyres we had available..."

Illustrates several interesting issues: The difficulty of diagnosing a problem from the cockpit. The difficulties faced by engineers trying to set up a vehicle for both qualifying & race. Importantly, how changing mechanical balance affects car & tyre performance. Also, incidentally, the importance of having cars "blue flagged" out of the way.

[olefud]

4.2 Weight distribution :
For 2012 and 2013 only, the weight applied on the front and rear wheels must not be less than 291kg and 342kg respectively at all times during the qualifying practice session.

I suppose a driver has to be careful not to brake or accelerate too much during qualifying runs.

[raymondu999]

It's clumsy diction, I agree. But to be fair they probably are talking about static mass distribution - with 291kg and 342kg.

[marcush.]

Here is an interesting article. A few extracts:

"Suddenly faced with understeer, Lewis wasn't able to diagnose the problem, referring to a loss of front downforce on the team radio."

"Hamilton's lap times tells the story. Lap 17 and 18 were 1m44.8s and 1m44.9s – then after the failure he went 1m46.1s, 1m46.6s, 1m47.0s and so on."

"Until the roll-bar failure Lewis was fighting for a place on the podium," said Whitmarsh. "He had an absolutely terrible car to drive, he had poor balance, he was absolutely destroying the tyres; in truth at that point I didn't think we'd get to the end of the race on the tyres we had available..."

Illustrates several interesting issues: The difficulty of diagnosing a problem from the cockpit. The difficulties faced by engineers trying to set up a vehicle for both qualifying & race. Importantly, how changing mechanical balance affects car & tyre performance. Also, incidentally, the importance of having cars "blue flagged" out of the way.

c´mon dave .A broken ARB should of course have a masssive effect on balance .You would not have a ARB if it was not havinng an effect.

Not being able to decifer aero from suspension caused issues is very telling for a driver of Hamiltons calibre..I bet an aero induced problem would make you suffer with increasing understeer the quicker the corner..
A car with a broken arb will ,on the other hand roll a lot more -causing the front grip to evaporate which will be of course a problem in slow corners more prominently and as long as you are not provoking the car it will not be as dramatic in the quick stuff -but sure you will feel the increase in roll ...
I´m sure your engineer will instantly see the problem -should -don´t you think so?

[DaveW]

c´mon dave .A broken ARB should of course have a masssive effect on balance .You would not have a ARB if it was not havinng an effect.

You would think so, wouldn't you. More than could be compensated by diff. maps, apparently.

I was quietly trying to make the point that, despite the current F1 mantra, mechanical set-up does matter both to the vehicle & its tyres. F1 would be well served if the current limitations on mechanical set-up were opened up, even to the point of allowing cockpit adjustable bars.

To be fair, I don't know their current suspension configuration. No corner springs would have made a broken bar very interesting...

[bill shoe]

I think tires are always the most important part of a high performance road race car. They have become almost dominantly important in F1 circa 2012 because the teams are so close on everything else. Pirelli has become a useful scapegoat for the fact that tires are more important than everything else. F1 has, properly, become a tire management formula and this pisses off F1. The tire supplier is a minor contributor to the financial pie, so surely that means tires should not be the most important part, right? Surely the engine suppliers who spend $gazillion per engine should be the determining factor, yes? And yet dammit! the Red Bulls with a slightly weaker engine are able to win the championship!! This is no good!! Engines are sexy, high rpm's are sexy, noise is sexy, and the damn tire supplier determines the champion. This will not do. We must say the tires are too sensitive. Or too something.

OK, sorry for the sarcasm. I'm serious though. I think the F1 teams are very close on non-tire issues, so tires will be the deciding factor for quite some time. I think Newey was the genius of the aero-era of F1. Now F1 is waiting for the next genius of the coming tire era. Someone who designs and runs the cars around the tires, and tells the aero boys to just go make something competitive. Honestly at this point aero is understood in F1 more than tires. Yet, foolishly, the team bosses try to conjure their own versions of the Newey-aero-genius while cursing the importance of tires! This brings to mind a quote about generals always building their armies to fight the previous war...

[Nando]

I honestly would like to see longer lasting tires.

I don´t think pit stops would increase that much because it would lead to teams not having to nurse the tires during the race, thus using up the tire faster.

Something in between this year (but with a broader operating window, not fun watching cars 3 seconds off pace for no reason) and Bridgestone´s.

Really the best thing would be to make tires durable and with a lot of grip, but enforce mandatory pit stops.

[raymondu999]

I honestly would like to see longer lasting tires.

I don´t think pit stops would increase that much because it would lead to teams not having to nurse the tires during the race, thus using up the tire faster.

What makes you so sure though? They might just use the extra life to extend the stints and make one less stop.

I agree with what you want in principle - I also miss seeing cars being flat out for 2 hours, but I don't think this is the way.

Personally I think they either need to make a tyre that doesn't respond well to being managed - ie there's no point in managing the tyre, so they might as well just push, as there's very little payback in extra stint life.

Another way, in my opinion, would be to reduce the pitstop delta. The reason teams want to manage tyres is to extend stint life and reduce the number of pitstops. If you can reduce the disadvantage of making a pitstop, then more teams will look to doing more stops on a "push harder" strategy.

Another possibility, though it may be too contrived, is a tyre that is almost made for a formula quicker than F1 - a tyre that trying to do tyre management will basically have the tyre too cold, and pushing is needed to maintain temps. Race starts and safety car restarts will be all over the place though.

[raymondu999]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/103511

Interestingly, while there are only a few construction and compound changes, the tyres will be heavier...

Do tyres count towards the 640kg minimum weight? Anyone?

[Jersey Tom]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/103511

Interestingly, while there are only a few construction and compound changes, the tyres will be heavier...

Do tyres count towards the 640kg minimum weight? Anyone?

I would certainly think so.

[Richard]

I guess the cars are weighed with tyres on because that's why the divers try to pick up marbles on track.

Anyway, the regs confirm this.

4.1 Minimum weight :
The weight of the car must not be less than 640kg at all times during the Event. If, when required for checking, a car is not already fitted with dry‐weather tyres, it will be weighed on a set of dry‐weather tyres selected by the FIA technical delegate.