Pirelli 2013

[Dragonfly]

If Bernie is able to override all rules and decisions then why they even bother writing them?

[FoxHound]

If Bernie is able to override all rules and decisions then why they even bother writing them?

Which rules has Bernie overridden?

[SectorOne]

Spanish newspapers and Amus should be taken with a truckload of salt. This whole Bernie thing might not even exist.

Let´s just wait for FIA´s decision.

[Pup]

If Bernie is able to override all rules and decisions then why they even bother writing them?

At the moment, there's no concord agreement in place, leaving something of a power vacuum for Bernie to do as he pleases.

[GTSpeedster]

Anyone who says that driving a 2013 car with 2013 tyres and 2013 drivers, for 1000kms, 250 laps, 3 race lengths for 3 days, does not gain you any knowledge in all kinds of areas that the computers are logging every millisecond is either clueless or is lying.

Seriously, how can anyone defend this? If it had been Red Bull or Ferrari doing this, those same people defending this would be demanding them to be kicked off the planet, let alone F1... What shame!

[WhiteBlue]

Mercedes' Niki Lauda, however, told Brazil's O Estado de S.Paulo that the FIA "sent a delegate" to the test, and that Charlie Whiting and Bernie Ecclestone knew about it as well....

Another valuable piece of information. If Charlie and Bernie knew about the plan it is even more likely that the protests are simply leading to a ceremonial session of the international tribunal without much consequences for Mercedes and Pirelli. There are plenty of excuses why it was done and good ways to re-establish sporting equity for teams that also want to test.

I found it funny that Christian Horner said the test was creating a big danger of unleashing a new testing cost wave in F1. The bulk of the costs were born by Pirelli and the expenses Merc had by staying in Barcelona with their race team are peanuts if you compare that with the test teams that used to be run in the past for tyre tests. It sounds funny if such nonsense comes from Red Bull, a team that blows away one of the biggest budgets in F1. If Ferrari, Lotus and Red Bull are offered a testing session of equal quality compared to Merc's test in Barcelona later in the season the sporting equity for the big teams is maintained in my view. It would not cost very much and Pirelli would pay the bulk of the cost. Naturally Bernie first has to shake hand with them for 2014 first to make them commit to the cost.

[WhiteBlue]

Anyone who says that driving a 2013 car with 2013 tyres and 2013 drivers, for 1000kms, 250 laps, 3 race lengths for 3 days, does not gain you any knowledge in all kinds of areas that the computers are logging every millisecond is either clueless or is lying.

Seriously, how can anyone defend this? If it had been Red Bull or Ferrari doing this, those same people defending this would be demanding them to be kicked off the planet, let alone F1... What shame!

Let is rest! Our local tyre experts all seem to agree that you are wrong.

[Gaara]

Anyone who says that driving a 2013 car with 2013 tyres and 2013 drivers, for 1000kms, 250 laps, 3 race lengths for 3 days, does not gain you any knowledge in all kinds of areas that the computers are logging every millisecond is either clueless or is lying.

Seriously, how can anyone defend this? If it had been Red Bull or Ferrari doing this, those same people defending this would be demanding them to be kicked off the planet, let alone F1... What shame!

Let is rest! Our local tyre experts all seem to agree that you are wrong.

I agree with GTpeedster. I'll give you another example WhiteBlue, let's say you have an exam. The professor gives you 3 days to study, he gives you few samples and you have to solve them. In the exam, you get similar questions to those you solved in the 3 days.

It doesn't matter if Mercedes gained an advantage or not. But Adam Cooper says in his blog some rumours are circulating that Mercedes tested a revised gearbox to solve its tyres problem.

So is it fair? Simple answer: No.

[raymondu999]

Analysis: How Pirelli Montreal change will handicap ‘tyre-swapping’ teams

An interesting twist to the Pirelli testing saga has emerged, and it throws a little more light on what Mercedes might or might not have done at Barcelona.

This blog can reveal that since the start of the season some teams have routinely being swapping the left and right rear tyres, having discovered – in some cases as early as winter testing – that they found an overall performance advantage by doing so.

The 2013 steel belt tyres are ‘handed,’ meaning that they are marked left and right and are intended by Pirelli to be used on that side of the car.

However there is nothing in the rules to stop teams from using them on the ‘wrong’ side, if they find it works better. However it’s not something that can be done without a considerable amount of attention to set-up and so on, in order to make the change work effectively.

Indeed in the case of some teams it even goes back to the design stage as they worked with data during the winter, having run prototype tyres in Brazil and decided – in effect – that Pirelli had got its sums wrong in defining the left and right side tyres.

Intriguingly sources have told this blog that in Monaco Mercedes used the swapping technique for the first time – or at least it was the first time that it was spotted by keen-eyed observers.

It would thus be very easy to speculate that Mercedes took the opportunity of the Barcelona test to try swapping the rears around.

However while it may have helped Mercedes in Monaco, it might not do so in Montreal – assuming that Pirelli follows up on its promise to switch from steel belts back to Kevlar, as used last year.

As is well known, the move has been touted on safety grounds, as a result of several cases of delaminating treads, which have caused embarrassment to the Italian company – even though many observers consider that a delamination is potentially safer than a complete tyre disintegration, as it allows the driver to carry on back to the pits.

Pirelli has insisted that the change won’t have a major impact on the competition.

However, Kevlar belted tyres are not ‘handed’ meaning they are identical on both sides – in other words there is no point in swapping them around.

And that means the teams that have been routinely swapping will lose the advantage they currently have, and that in turn explains why they a) they are now fighting with Pirelli and the FIA over the planned change and b) why those teams who have not been able to make tyre swapping work, or have general tyre issues, are only too happy for it to go through…

It’s also clear that the change of belts represents a change of specification, which usually has to be cleared by all the teams.

If the change does happen it will provide further ammunition for Red Bull and Ferrari given that it is widely accepted that Mercedes tried the revised tyres in Barcelona, and thus have the huge advantage of being the only team to have already run 2013 Kevlar-belted tyres.

Inevitably the speculation is that Mercedes didn’t just try tyres in Barcelona, but also its own components. It’s even been suggested that the team ran a gearbox with revised suspension geometry in attempt to get to the bottom of its tyre problems.

This story is far from over yet…

Source: http://adamcooperf1.com/2013/05/28/anal ... ing-teams/

[WhiteBlue]

I have never denied that the Barcelona test created a problem with sporting equity. That is surely the case whatever they did to mask the data and keep them from being useful for Mercedes. The question in my view is how big is the unbalance and is it big enough to justify punishment. The inequity was primarily created because the teams denied Pirelli access to adequate testing with current machinery. So sometimes you have to select the lesser evil.

I have no doubt that any kind of inequity that occurred can be easily cured by further tests of similar make up with other teams. It appears to me that the tribunal will also see it that way. It has been reported that the FiA had observers at the test. It is up to the federation to make sure the other teams get similar opportunities.

I do have doubts that Pirelli have allowed Mercedes to test different car configurations, especially different gear boxes. That would contradict the purpose of the test for which they paid. I take it as one of the wild rumors that naturally are created as soon as someone starts to add up apples and bananas.

[noname]

Who paid for the test? Was it Pirelli, FIA?, Mercedes? 3 days of running F1 car is a significant chunk of money. Mercedes ate the cost, and did not get any benefits, just because they like Pirelli and wanted to help them?

[SectorOne]

Mysterious sources and general speculation.... yea that´ll work in court.

[WhiteBlue]

It has been confirmed that it was a Pirelli test and they naturally paid for it which is mainly renting the track and the services. Estimates are beyond €1m. I reckon that Mercedes participated foc. So they had to pay for their own cost one assumes. But those costs are small compared to running a test team at a completely different location. You have just the engines, fuel and wear parts plus the cost for your engineering team to be on site. The drivers are not being paid. I can imagine that Pirelli would even pay for fuel, engines and and wear parts. So net cost to Merc was probably very small. I mean you are talking an amount of money a driver causes by destroying a car in a heavy crash and you have to rebuild it. Teams routinely absorb this kind of cost with no problems.

[Gaara]

So if the test was for Pirelli, why they didn't let Pirelli test drivers test the tyres? Why lewis and nico?

[turbof1]

So if the test was for Pirelli, why they didn't let Pirelli test drivers test the tyres? Why lewis and nico?

Part of the test was to find out why the tyre in Bahrain delaminated, so they needed Lewis to try to replicate that. Besides that, those drivers have driven races and can tell how different the car feels when driven on different tyres; essentially they are the perfect test drivers for the mercedes. And the FIA explicitly told that it is allowed.

Whiteblue, who exactly confirmed it was a "pirelli test"? If that can be undisputably be proven, the sporting regulations are effectively nullified, because Mercedes didn't test.