Lewis Hamilton led the Qatar Grand Prix from start to finish with Max Verstappen also soon settling into second place. The action mainly happened behind them where Alonso for instance returned to the podium after 7 years.
then why was their inconsistency between electronic and manual system?
There can only be 5 reasons for system failure.
1 WI not followed
2 WI not understood
3 WI not effective
4 Person don't want to follow WI (discipline)
5 Person not trained to be competent in following WI
The light panels and the steering wheel lights are controlled by the race director. He reacts to the marshals waving the flags. The failure was in race control, not at track side. I note that you don't include that failure mode in your list.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.
Wow, again after Sotschi this doesnt feel like a win somehow.
This Verstappen guy will never get punished by penalties... except Bottas could play some Bowling again.
Weird comment when Hamilton got disqualified and yet still won the race a week ago.
It is how it feels and I am sure not to be the only one here...
And last week we read many comments Like that on dutch forums and platforms
Max and Lewis are just in a league of their own. Their pace advantage over the rest of the field is such that they can often nullify 5 &10 second penalties, or other setbacks.
Max here, Lewis in Brazil, Max in Russia, Lewis in silverstone, Lewis in monza, etc.
Let's all just admire it instead of getting annoyed by it.
Last edited by TimW on 21 Nov 2021, 19:24, edited 1 time in total.
I don't disagree with the "rule" that the "physical" flags take precedence I say there was a system failure as the two systems was not working in tandem, Why, why did it fail? who did not do their job?
If memory serves the electronic system is controlled by someone in race control, not a Marshall.
according to this, it's controlled by marshals...
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
yes, system failure, marshall did not follow work instruction. why was drs enabled? why lights not on? who failed to do their job and why?
The marshal did his job - he saw a potentially dangerous situation and waved the yellow flag to warn approaching drivers. That is what his job is in that situation - nothing else. What happens after that is not his concern - that's the race director's purview.
Marshals don't wait for race control to tell them to wave the yellow flags. Race control react to the yellow flags just as the drivers do.
no, marshals update the track status from their stations... you are stuck in the old school thinking that marshals are only good at waving flag. they are now capable of more. They have evolved. they rely on electronic systems also... someone did not do their job. it was a system failure.
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake
If memory serves the electronic system is controlled by someone in race control, not a Marshall.
according to this, it's controlled by marshals...
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
you are making up your own facts. just listen... "sent to RC AND driver display panel."
the biggest problem here is selective listening
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake
so a system failure by a marshal (a marshal must activate the electronic system from the marshaling post)
You are clearly being purposely obtuse.
The electronic system is irrelevant. If a driver relies on the electronic system be it visual or audible or treats that as the only one that matters then again they have failed and are liable for any penalty.
it's not "irrelevant" it's part of the marshalling system, else why is it there, nice to have?
If you come upon a city bus on the street, and the driver is shouting and waving his arm out the window that he is going to turn right, but his indicators are showing that he turns left...
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
you are making up your own facts. just listen... "sent to RC AND driver display panel."
the biggest problem here is selective listening
But none of that matters. The flag was there so had to be obeyed
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
you are making up your own facts. just listen... "sent to RC AND driver display panel."
the biggest problem here is selective listening
not sure where you got that quote from, the below is what you get when you turn on CC! I can post additional screenshots if you like?
As soon as they activate the flag, the signal is sent, not just to the flag panel but to race control and the steering wheel bashboards of any drivers in the affected sector.
A little later
So if a controlling marshal spots an event in their sector they, say, activate the yellow flag, double yellow flag, blue flag, slippery surface flag or whatever and this information is sent to race control where they can tap into cameras, including CCTV, and communicate with the marshals to decide further action like a safety car or a red flag.
Note that only a single marshaling sector is highlighted.
If you take a look at the race directors notes (page you will see that Losail has 20 marshming sectors. Gasly incident occurred in sector 18 on the exit of turn 15, he limped through sector 19, and game to a stop towards the end of sector 20. The marshal in sector 20 was the one who was waving the double yellow flags.
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
you are making up your own facts. just listen... "sent to RC AND driver display panel."
the biggest problem here is selective listening
But none of that matters. The flag was there so had to be obeyed
Yes, the simplistic view, why it happened, criticizing the failure and understanding the contributing variables is not important. technicalities are not sensational.
what is more important is who gets effected by this.
might as well save cost and scrap the system.
guess it's a "show"
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake
Re watch the video, They only control the screen in their marshaling sector. Race control is the one that decides what other Marshaling sectors should do. Keep in mind there are dozens of martialing sectors on a given track.
Also, the all clear was given before before gasly even came around the last turn so that has nothing to do with the Marshal who actually wave the double yellow flags.
you are making up your own facts. just listen... "sent to RC AND driver display panel."
the biggest problem here is selective listening
not sure where you got that quote from, the below is what you get when you turn on CC! I can post additional screenshots if you like?
As soon as they activate the flag, the signal is sent, not just to the flag panel but to race control and the steering wheel bashboards of any drivers in the affected sector.
A little later
So if a controlling marshal spots an event in their sector they, say, activate the yellow flag, double yellow flag, blue flag, slippery surface flag or whatever and this information is sent to race control where they can tap into cameras, including CCTV, and communicate with the marshals to decide further action like a safety car or a red flag.
If you take a look at the race directors notes (page you will see that Losail has 20 marshming sectors. Gasly incident occurred in sector 18 on the exit of turn 15, he limped through sector 19, and game to a stop towards the end of sector 20. The marshal in sector 20 was the one who was waving the double yellow flags.
Thanks, so witch marshal did not do his job (went rouge) and did not activate the electronic system ?
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake
The Stewards, having received a report from the Race Director, summoned (document 50) and
heard from the Team Principal, have considered the following matter and determine the following
Also sounds like horner will be doing a little community service early next year as well.
Mr Horner offered to apologise to the marshal concerned and to explain to the media
that he meant no offense.
He also offered to participate in the 2022 FIA International Stewards Programme in
early February.
The Stewards unreservedly accept Mr Horner’s offer.
The Stewards, having received a report from the Race Director, summoned (document 50) and
heard from the Team Principal, have considered the following matter and determine the following
Also sounds like horner will be doing a little community service early next year as well.
Mr Horner offered to apologise to the marshal concerned and to explain to the media
that he meant no offense.
He also offered to participate in the 2022 FIA International Stewards Programme in
early February.
The Stewards unreservedly accept Mr Horner’s offer.
So there was a rouge marshal, Horner was just not supposed to say it.
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake
Which neatly leads us back to Horner using the world's media to blame what he personally decided was a 'Rogue Marshal' for his driver refusing to slow down in response to a clear 'danger' signal.
Because that's the issue here, despite laughably transparent attempts to muddy the waters. Why did Horner blame someone else for his driver not observing the rules? How is that 'strong leadership'? It's the act of a 5-year old who got caught doing something wrong and cries "Another boy did it!"
