Belgian GP 2010 - Spa Francorchamps

[ringo]

Hamilton's trip, i was like , then , then =D> aahhhh .
China 2007 flashback indeed.

You know, if Alonso had a clean race he seriously could have caught Massa. The rain setup would have paid off today.

Smedley to Massa team radio:
Alonso has the rain setup... ok?
Your car is losing grip out of turn 1.... do you understand?

[Dragonfly]

Vettel almost killed Button. Steam was shooting out every where! You can't just steer your sliding car into another driver, that is what run offs are for. Deserved penalty I say.

Or more precisely, you cannot steer a sliding car at all.

Smedley to Massa team radio:
Alonso has the rain setup... ok?
Your car is losing grip out of turn 1.... do you understand?

I somehow was deluded that at least this forum is not a place for making elementary joke attempts.

[myurr]

I hope he matures into a good racer. His raw pace is unquestionable.

+1. Having supported Vettel through his rise in Formula BMW and also supporting him through his BMW F1 days, it really pains me to see how Vettel threw away a 2nd place, and shows that he is still susceptible to brainfade.

It was also a bit galling to keep hearing commentators making excuses for Vettel, saying how he's still maturing as a driver. He's in his 4th season and has only driven 9 less races than Lewis and yet more often than not he makes a complete hash of an overtake and seems unable to make his way through the front end of the field. He's young but he's now experienced enough in F1 and it's time to deliver.

[zenithbeach]

shame alguesuari lost his point

well done to hamilton though! decent racing.

btw what was webber doing at the start? if you want to be world champion you must not copy your team mate's starts

as for alonso, karma is a bitch lol

[raymondu999]

I hope he matures into a good racer. His raw pace is unquestionable.

+1. Having supported Vettel through his rise in Formula BMW and also supporting him through his BMW F1 days, it really pains me to see how Vettel threw away a 2nd place, and shows that he is still susceptible to brainfade.

It was also a bit galling to keep hearing commentators making excuses for Vettel, saying how he's still maturing as a driver. He's in his 4th season and has only driven 9 less races than Lewis and yet more often than not he makes a complete hash of an overtake and seems unable to make his way through the front end of the field. He's young but he's now experienced enough in F1 and it's time to deliver.

Actually, this is an interesting point. Has Sebi raced in series's with reverse grids before? I know he skipped GP2, and I know Lewis went through GP2 which does help a bit in terms of overtaking skill, I must admit

[Dragonfly]

In no way am I defending Vettel. It was his fault being overly aggressive and bringing his car into an uncontrollable state.
What I don't agree is that he deliberately steered into Button's car.
In fact I am beginning to be more critical towards Vettel. His teammate is showing an example of focusing on the job and psychological stability, which IMHO has a negative effect on the young German. And, if he does not find a way to overcome this, relying only on himself, no matter how naturally fast he may be, he'll become just a possibility that never materialized in a successful driver and a champion.

[Ray]

I don't think the way some people here come down on Seb is entirely fair.

And your bias towards anyone German and your constant excuses for poor performances by said Germans isn't fair either.

In his post race comment he said that he braked while his car was still unsettled from a bump and Horner said he probably did not expect Button to brake as early as he did.

Translation: I made another stupid mistake, took out another competitor while fighting for position towards the front of the field because I can't overtake another driver without hitting them. Now that we've established what my excuse was for not making a clean pass I'll do what I usually do and blame the driver I ran into for not getting out of my way, instead he was making sure that due to the damage on his car he was maximizing the potential of his car to keep me behind him. I didn't agree with his move so I rammed him.

Alonso was just lucky that his mistake did not take out someone else.

You mean like the two completely stupid moves Seb has made and taken out his teammate and leader of the race? Yeah, Alonsos mistake was directly comparable. It was a simple mistake, not one that took out another competitor directly because he can't control his car while passing. You're indirectly comparing one of only two real passers in Formula 1 to Vettel who rams people? Alonso isn't a foolhardy passer like Vettel and he isn't lucky he didn't take anyone out, that's where the car stopped he didn't park it there. Unlike another one of your German counterparts who did exactly that.

Lewis drove a fantastic race and I was literally out of my seat saying NO! when he almost beached it! Would have been heartbreaking to see that drive ruined by one slick corner. It blows me away that neither Webber nor Kubica pitted when Lewis drover past. It made zero sense to pass that opportunity up. Great race overall.

[raymondu999]

Well with Lewis having led every single lap (I do believe he did a Mark Webber-in-Silverstone style take the lead from 2nd and take it to the flag style win, didn't he?) I think beaching it would have led to a Hakkinen Monza moment, where he would just do what Hakkinen did back then and went and wept in a bush somewhere.

[747heavy]

Actually, this is an interesting point. Has Sebi raced in series's with reverse grids before? I know he skipped GP2, and I know Lewis went through GP2 which does help a bit in terms of overtaking skill, I must admit

Don´t think so, it´s not that much used in open wheel racing (reversed grid), it´s more a touring car racing thing.
I agree that one or two seasons in GP2/F3000 would not have hurt him (any driver) as far a race craft goes. Sure he is quick, but at times lacking race craft IMHO.

Maybe some people get rushed into F1 to quickly, to become the next "wonder boy".
I think Ron Dennis, made a good call in letting Hamilton earn his stripes in GP2.

He drove a very good/mature race today, so hat´s off to him, apart from the little glitch which could have cost him dearly.
But I would also blame the team a bit for that, in this conditions on that track, you may not talk opera´s on the radio.

[zenithbeach]

Translation: ...Now that we've established what my excuse was for not making a clean pass I'll do what I usually do and blame the driver I ran into for not getting out of my way

in the interview ive watched vettel clearly admitted that it was his own fault. he never put any blame on button.

and btw his move on kubica was A+

his other moves were rather.. poopy but hey, he got punished twice for his silly moves. what more do you want

[raymondu999]

Actually, this is an interesting point. Has Sebi raced in series's with reverse grids before? I know he skipped GP2, and I know Lewis went through GP2 which does help a bit in terms of overtaking skill, I must admit

Don´t think so, it´s not that much used in open wheel racing (reversed grid), it´s more a touring car racing thing.
I agree that one or two seasons in GP2/F3000 would not have hurt him (any driver) as far a race craft goes. Sure he is quick, but at times lacking race craft IMHO.

Maybe some people get rushed into F1 to quickly, to become the next "wonder boy".
I think Ron Dennis, made a good call in letting Hamilton earn his stripes in GP2.

He drove a very good/mature race today, so hat´s off to him, apart from the little glitch which could have cost him dearly.
But I would also blame the team a bit for that, in this conditions on that track, you may not talk opera´s on the radio.

I think someone made an absolutely valid point today, that absolute power corrupts absolutely. We know that Vettel is supremely fast, and I doubt anyone can doubt that. We know from 2008/2009 that he is an extremely likeable guy though, very nice and upbeat, and a breath of fresh air. But he has now a car that delivers supreme laptimes in the RB6, and that seems to corrupt him.

It almost makes me wish he'd done what Schumi did in 1996 and joined a struggling team (perhaps such as HRT/Lotus?) and helped to build the team from the ground up, playing a major role in the car's design, and building the team around him. I think that would do him a lot of good for character development as a driver.

Back on topic then. I agree that Lewis drove sublimely But I'd rather have the Lewis Hamilton of old, fighting up from 18th/19th to podiums/wins. Much more exciting if you ask me

[Ray]

Translation: ...Now that we've established what my excuse was for not making a clean pass I'll do what I usually do and blame the driver I ran into for not getting out of my way

in the interview ive watched vettel clearly admitted that it was his own fault. he never put any blame on button.

and btw his move on kubica was A+

his other moves were rather.. poopy but hey, he got punished twice for his silly moves. what more do you want

I've not seen that interview, so that part may be wrong and I'll fess up if I am. What I want is Vettel to quit ramming other people because he can't keep control of his damn car and for peopleto quit making excuses for him. He's made bonehead moves before and people need to quit chalking it up as a racing incident. It's not. It's stupid moves.

[andrew]

Red Bull post race comments:

Mark Webber: “The start was a mess, it wasn’t ideal to lose that many positions, but fortunately it’s not Monaco or Barcelona where the positions often don’t change during the race. I was able to overtake a few guys on the first few laps and get some of the positions back – I knew the race would be quite long after that and to get second place was a good result. It was very challenging in the last part of the Grand Prix and it was difficult to keep the car on track. I can’t believe the top three qualifiers finished on the podium with all the changing conditions! It was a good day for me. It was unfortunate for the team that we didn’t get some more points, but we’re still leading the Constructors’ Championship and hopefully we will do in Monza.”

Sebastian Vettel: “What happened, happened and we can’t change it now. Obviously I’m not proud of it, I lost the car going over the bump as I was braking and unfortunately hit Jenson, so he couldn’t continue. I’m sorry for him. We’ll have to see what we can do at the next races.”

Christian Horner, Team Principal: ”A great drive by Mark today, it was a very mature drive after a bad start. He recovered fantastically well and drove with great maturity at a track that we always knew would suit the McLarens. To come away with second place was a great result for him today – and it was great pit-work by the guys to get Mark out ahead of Kubica. For Sebastian, unfortunately everything that could happen today did happen. He got pushed on to the grass on the first lap and then when he was coming back through the field was racing with Jenson. I think Jenson took him by surprise with how early he braked for the bus-stop and trying to avoid him Sebastian got into a bit of a moment and collected Jenson. He was then unlucky with Liuzzi, so not a great weekend for Sebastian.”

Fabrice Lom, Renault, Principal Engineer Track Support: “What a hectic race with a lot of action in mixed conditions. It was a solid race for Mark, who took no extra risks and did whatever he could to bring the car home for a well deserved second place. Hamilton was too strong for us today and I think second was the best we could achieve. Sebastian had an accident and I think his race was over after that. Congratulations to Kubica, I think to have two Renaults on the podium at this circuit is a great result for us.“

[zenithbeach]

I've not seen that interview, so that part may be wrong and I'll fess up if I am. What I want is Vettel to quit ramming other people because he can't keep control of his damn car and for peopleto quit making excuses for him. He's made bonehead moves before and people need to quit chalking it up as a racing incident. It's not. It's stupid moves.

i agree he's still in the learning process. this season particularly seems to be a tutoring experience for him if anything. he's made so many mistakes this year and has reacted like a little kid after most of them. however, this particular time he fessed up to it and i hope (for his sake) that this is a step into the right direction. its about time as well, if he's still throwing so many points away next year i might just wring his neck.

it's a bit like hamilton years ago, when he was so close to winning. you just wanted to wring his neck for the mistakes that cost him dearly lol

[Pierre6]

Whitmarsh said after the race:

"It was not what you would expect to see in F1 - more reminiscent of junior formulae," Whitmarsh said immediately after the race. "A drive-through seemed a pretty light punishment to me."

Hilarious.