Japanese GP 2010 - Suzuka

[ringo]

heidfeld was impressive i must say and kobayashi. Heidfeld looks like the faster driver. Kobayashi is like Hamilton, just much sloppier.
Both had good overtakes but Hamilton on Heidfeld was master craft.

SHumacher was impressive; driving off memories of suzuka.
Alonso, lotus drivers, Vettel, clean race.

Button is slooowwwww. Get him outa there. His monza race was lauded as his best show of speed. He got his ass whooped by Alonso there, yet they say he did well.
Now he goes on fresh tyres and can't even run down Alonso.
Hamilton on the same tyres as alonso and cutting down time every sector.

Button is useles and has no way of winning this year. His consistency is only making him look like a good #2.

[vall]

You obviously do not remember how the guy on your avatar drove at Spa 2008? Those are far more dangerous and unnecessary dirty moves on several oponentss, so do not complain about Kobayashi, he was brilliant today....

You obviously dont remember how the guy on his avatar drove at Spa 2008. The whole race sat behind Kimi then one cut chicane which have gave back the position and Kimi tagged him. Dangerous and dirty? Several opponents? Are you thinking clearly!?

I thought it was Spa, but maybe it was another wet race in 2008. That year there quite a few rain affected races.

EDIT: it was Monza 2008, sorry. I think I made the same mistake in other posts.

[WhiteBlue]

I really think Webber is just as fast as Vettel now.

You are in a very elite circle of friends with that opinion. If Webber hadn't consistently been lucky to see his competitors DNF out of races and get away himself with mediocre speed he would be no higher than P3 today. In Singapore he was slow in FP, qualy and the race. He should have suffered a puncture like Hamilton in that tangle but he was incredibly lucky. In Suzuka he was consistently the slower of the two Red Bull drivers in all sessions often by half a second per lap. To compare him with Vettel on speed can only embarrass the Australian. He is a lucky old man who makes few mistakes in the fastest car. I bet Kobayashi would beat him on speed eight days out of ten in the same car.

[andartop]

What a race! =D>

Too bad the safety car had to come out at the start, denying us possible fights throughout the field in the opening laps...

What on earth were Petrov and Massa thinking? Massa in particular should have known better for all his experience, though to be fair he did seem on the replays to have been squeezed out of the track..

The RBRs totally dominated and controlled the whole race. Would have been nice to see Webber put some pressure on Vettel, but guess he just wasn't fast enough. So well done Vettel, but you still owe us to actually overtake someone on track for a win!

Alonso best of the rest, kept his cool and delivered the maximum possible out of that car. If his team mate could only try and be closer to him performance wise Ferrari could have been challenging McLaren for second in the WCC standings..

For all the arguments and Hamilton's moves and stunning performances, it's interesting to see which of the two McLaren drivers will end up ahead in the standings at the end of the year, only 3 points separating them now! One has to admire Hamilton's fighting spirit and apparent talent, but JB keeps bringing good points home as well, though in a much less spectacular way. To those saying Hamilton is unlucky, please give it a break: most other drivers had their share of bad luck this season (ie Alonso), and Hamilton had some quite lucky escapes earlier (ie Spa)..

Schumi resurrected and arguably gave us one of his best performances this season. Here's hoping next year's car will be better and challenging for victories. I want to see Red Bull vs Ferrari vs McLaren vs Mercedes vs Renault and 10 drivers fighting for the WDC rather than 5!!!

Driver of the race? I always say that this goes to the race winner de facto, but today it could only be Kamui!!! I just love this guy's attitude, and to be honest where Sauber are at the moment I can't see why he should be driving cautiously or doing anything different..I like this car and this driver makes it look faster! =D>

[zeph]

Button is slooowwwww. Get him outa there. His monza race was lauded as his best show of speed. He got his ass whooped by Alonso there, yet they say he did well.

I missed that race, but I thought he lost P1 because of a pit stop?

I really think Webber is just as fast as Vettel now.

You are in a very elite circle of friends with that opinion. If Webber hadn't consistently been lucky to see his competitors DNF out of races and get away himself with mediocre speed he would be no higher than P3 today.

Uhm, I think that is not entirely true. Webber was the man to beat in Spain, Monaco and Turkey. He out-qualified Vettel and won the former two races fair and square. And I think he could have won Turkey as well, but that remains subject to debate.

To those saying Hamilton is unlucky, please give it a break: most other drivers had their share of bad luck this season (ie Alonso), and Hamilton had some quite lucky escapes earlier (ie Spa)..

This.

[Pedro]

Pit-stops




Stints

[Ray]

I really think Webber is just as fast as Vettel now.

You are in a very elite circle of friends with that opinion. If Webber hadn't consistently been lucky to see his competitors DNF out of races and get away himself with mediocre speed he would be no higher than P3 today. In Singapore he was slow in FP, qualy and the race. He should have suffered a puncture like Hamilton in that tangle but he was incredibly lucky. In Suzuka he was consistently the slower of the two Red Bull drivers in all sessions often by half a second per lap. To compare him with Vettel on speed can only embarrass the Australian. He is a lucky old man who makes few mistakes in the fastest car. I bet Kobayashi would beat him on speed eight days out of ten in the same car.

And how many wins does Vettel have where he had to pass for the lead or pass multiple cars? I seem to remember Webber winning a race with a drive through for good measure.

[Rino]

And how many wins does Vettel have where he had to pass for the lead or pass multiple cars?

Lol...so true...

[ringo]

To those saying Hamilton is unlucky, please give it a break: most other drivers had their share of bad luck this season (ie Alonso), and Hamilton had some quite lucky escapes earlier (ie Spa)..

This.

So every driver has a luck bag to collect their share of luck.
Hamilton is the unlickiest driver this season, aside from truli and luizi.

He has had 3 bad races in a row,1 of which he could be blamed for, which driver has had that?

Hamilton had no lucky escapes. Spa was not luck, anyone could look at that and see that he took control of the car to keep it on track. Luck is when the driver has no involvement in his fortune; such as others crashing out, or weather, or mechanical failures.

A wdc challenger qualifies 3rd, has grid penalty,and still had a gearbox failure; he's lucky indeed.

[Terrible3]

So well done Vettel, but you still owe us to actually overtake someone on track for a win!

I do recall him overtaking MW on lap one this year for a win......

[Gerhard Berger]

To those saying Hamilton is unlucky, please give it a break: most other drivers had their share of bad luck this season (ie Alonso), and Hamilton had some quite lucky escapes earlier (ie Spa)..

This.

So every driver has a luck bag to collect their share of luck.
Hamilton is the unlickiest driver this season, aside from truli and luizi.

He has had 3 bad races in a row,1 of which he could be blamed for, which driver has had that?

Hamilton had no lucky escapes. Spa was not luck, anyone could look at that and see that he took control of the car to keep it on track. Luck is when the driver has no involvement in his fortune; such as others crashing out, or weather, or mechanical failures.

A wdc challenger qualifies 3rd, has grid penalty,and still had a gearbox failure; he's lucky indeed.

In Spa he was lucky not to hit the wall. Then you have Malaysia and Cananda where he was lucky to avoid penalties, Turkey where he was gifted the win by the Red Bulls, and Valencia, it's quite clear he did have some good luck earlier in the season.

It seems to have been balanced out with bad luck though - car problems in Japan, Spain and Hungary, plus the Singapore hit.

[ringo]

Lucky not to avoid penalties?
What does that have to do with luck?
In your opinion he deserved a penalty but that is yours. In my opinion, that it's the oppositie.

Try better than that. I don't even look on what penalties could have been. Others drivers had similar experiences.I am looking at what actually happened. Penalties are in the hands of the stewards, that cannot be considered lucky, it's still under control by men.

He wasn't gifted a win in Turkey, he pushed for it. Alonso was gifted a win in Germany; why not mention that?
There is no balance, Hamilton is tipping the scales on bad luck.

[andartop]

I do recall him overtaking MW on lap one this year for a win......

Don't get me wrong, I do acknowledge Vettel's ability to overtake, but I would just love to see him having to actually work hard during a race to overtake other cars and climb up to 1st starting from further back on the grid. Most of his wins he has managed from pole, and none as far as I can remember starting from midfield.

So every driver has a luck bag to collect their share of luck.
Hamilton is the unlickiest driver this season, aside from truli and luizi.

He has had 3 bad races in a row,1 of which he could be blamed for, which driver has had that?

Hamilton had no lucky escapes. Spa was not luck, anyone could look at that and see that he took control of the car to keep it on track. Luck is when the driver has no involvement in his fortune; such as others crashing out, or weather, or mechanical failures.

A wdc challenger qualifies 3rd, has grid penalty,and still had a gearbox failure; he's lucky indeed.

Let's not turn this into another thread about who likes Hamilton and who does not. Obviously, one can interpret luck or lack of in different ways. In my opinion losing it in slippery conditions as in Spa and getting away with it was kinda lucky, as it could have easily ended in tears had he banged his front left a touch harder or got stuck in the gravel. One can consider this as bad luck (because he slipped) counteracted by driver control (because he saved it), or as driver error (because he slipped) saved by luck (because he didn't hit a wall or get stuck in gravel). All I'm saying is all title contenders this year have had some good luck and some bad luck. At the end of the season, no matter who gets the WDC, there will be some people calculating what could have/would have happened if their favourite driver had been a touch luckier or their contenders a touch unluckier! I find this sad...

[Ray]

Lucky not to avoid penalties?
What does that have to do with luck?

If you go back and look penalties are hit and miss. Luck has everything to do with what stupid decision the stewards make. Kinda like Russian Roulette. Any time the graphic comes up that something is being investigated there is a whole heap of luck as to what and/or whom is going to get screwed with a stupid penalty that hasn't been uniformly applied.

Alonso was gifted a win in Germany; why not mention that?

And what was Lewis passing Heikki in Germany a few years back? Luck? Or team orders?

Lewis is having a rash of bad luck no doubt, but to act like he's the only one that is suffering this year in the championship isn't exactly fair. In fact I'd say he's pretty damn lucky after todays race. If it had been Kimi's McLaren from a few years back that gearbox would have fallen off the car. He's had a bad few races, but he hasn't been that unlucky.

[Giblet]

These gearboxes can handle Monaco and the sheer number of shifts there. With shifting being a clutchless pushnof a button and far less shifting at japan there is no sane reason to blame Lewis for his gearbox.

Actually Monaco has the 4th least number of gearshifts per lap on the F1 calendar. It has the exact same number of shifts as Japan, 46. However yes Monaco has 78 laps where as Japan is only 53. Its Singapore that's hard on the gearboxes with 72 shifts a lap.

Like I said Monaco has more shifts. Per lap is a rather academic measure. You need to get the car home.

.