2012 German GP - Hockenheim

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

2012 German GP - Hockenheim

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2010
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Strategy
2012 tyres - Medium (prime, white) and Soft (option, yellow)
2011 tyres - Medium (prime, white) and Soft (option, yellow) *different track layout
2010 tyres - Hard (prime, no stripe) and Supersoft (option, stripe) *Bridgestone tyres

2010 pole lap (Vettel):
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nNw8WjAEMw[/youtube]

*2011 Grand Prix was on a different circuit
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SeijaKessen
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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How I wish they would restore the old Hockenheimring.

Would be really interesting to see a race where top speeds are a greater factor for the duration of the race.

beelsebob
beelsebob
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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SeijaKessen wrote:How I wish they would restore the old Hockenheimring.

Would be really interesting to see a race where top speeds are a greater factor for the duration of the race.
You mean like Monza?

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Guisson
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Joined: 04 Mar 2012, 12:59
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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It is surely ..But a bit too dangerous..After the Death of Jim clark and Patrick Depailler they choosed to transform the circuit into sthg less risky..
I predict Ferraris On the Front Btw with the Red Bulls not far away ( And Maybe Lotus ..Or mclarens [ At least Hammy] )
The task is,not so much to see what no one has yet seenbut to think what nobody has yet thought, about that which everybody sees. Erwin Schrödinger

beelsebob
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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RB_[Gnx] wrote:It is surely ..But a bit too dangerous..After the Death of Jim clark and Patrick Depailler they choosed to transform the circuit into sthg less risky..
I predict Ferraris On the Front Btw with the Red Bulls not far away ( And Maybe Lotus ..Or mclarens [ At least Hammy] )
The change from old to new hockenheim was much much later than those two deaths – 2001.

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SeijaKessen
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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beelsebob wrote:
SeijaKessen wrote:How I wish they would restore the old Hockenheimring.

Would be really interesting to see a race where top speeds are a greater factor for the duration of the race.
You mean like Monza?
Yes.

I should have phrased that a little better in saying, it would be interesting to see more races where top speeds are a greater factor for the duration of the race. :D

I'm probably in the minority, but I love Monza because of the speeds. Not that I don't mind technical circuits here and there, but I adore tracks where there is a good flow to the circuit that lets the cars stretch their legs.

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SeijaKessen
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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beelsebob wrote:
RB_[Gnx] wrote:It is surely ..But a bit too dangerous..After the Death of Jim clark and Patrick Depailler they choosed to transform the circuit into sthg less risky..
I predict Ferraris On the Front Btw with the Red Bulls not far away ( And Maybe Lotus ..Or mclarens [ At least Hammy] )
The change from old to new hockenheim was much much later than those two deaths – 2001.
It was a sad day when that happened.

Ironically the post-2001 layout is the only Tilke design I have less of an issue with than most.

I just always felt there was something magical about seeing the cars screaming at over 200MPH into the German forests.

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Mestrades
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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It was really fantastic... The old Hockenhaim was magic.

Nando
Nando
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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Hopefully this will be a great comparison with 2010, performance wise.

Anyone know the temps in 2010? air/track temp.
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marcush.
marcush.
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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the original hockenheim track was built 1932 in 12 weeks just motorcycle racing and was just a triangle of sorts comprising of the Ostkurve and a Hairpin (today barely visible at the Firestation in Hockenheim) .The west part of the track in Hockenheim was lost when the Autobahn was built and it was Wilhelm Herz who pushed and succeeded in building the Motodrom to transform the remains of the old "Kurpfalzring" track into a permanent racetrack .
.. the Motodrom with the famous "Waldgerade" and Ostkurve ....but it was just too quick and if I´m correct the track was changed first adding the chicanes dividing the long Straights and after the death of Patrick Depaillier in a huge testing crash after a brake failure in 1980 adding a chicane just before Ostkurve ...With the chicanes it was not quite the same but still aweinspiring I remember standing at the fence in the forest during testing two weeks before the GP and you saw the cars at an amazing speed flying by...(Renault Turbo Jabouille and Arnoux !)..something I will never forget.
I´m not quite sure when the Jim Clark and Ayrton Senna Chicanes were changed as the first iteration was very fluid and quick but later it was very slow 2nd gear ..

andartop
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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The 1990's configuration was one of my favorite F1 tracks, up there with Spa, Suzuka and Monza.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Hocke ... o_2002.svg

I voted the changes to the layout as the biggest crime in F1 history in the relevant thread, and haven't changed my mind. It's like taking Eau Rouge, 130R or Parabolica out.. :x
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SeijaKessen
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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marcush. wrote: the original hockenheim track was built 1932 in 12 weeks just motorcycle racing and was just a triangle of sorts comprising of the Ostkurve and a Hairpin (today barely visible at the Firestation in Hockenheim) .The west part of the track in Hockenheim was lost when the Autobahn was built and it was Wilhelm Herz who pushed and succeeded in building the Motodrom to transform the remains of the old "Kurpfalzring" track into a permanent racetrack .
.. the Motodrom with the famous "Waldgerade" and Ostkurve ....but it was just too quick and if I´m correct the track was changed first adding the chicanes dividing the long Straights and after the death of Patrick Depaillier in a huge testing crash after a brake failure in 1980 adding a chicane just before Ostkurve ...With the chicanes it was not quite the same but still aweinspiring I remember standing at the fence in the forest during testing two weeks before the GP and you saw the cars at an amazing speed flying by...(Renault Turbo Jabouille and Arnoux !)..something I will never forget.
I´m not quite sure when the Jim Clark and Ayrton Senna Chicanes were changed as the first iteration was very fluid and quick but later it was very slow 2nd gear ..
Awesome post Marcus. =D>

I've got a question, when you saw Arnoux in the Renault Turbo, was it after they added the chicane before the Ostkurve? I can't imagine how great it would have been to stand there listening to the turbo Renault.

I actually do have the entire 1981 race which was the last time F1 raced without a chicane before the Ostkurve. I wish I could post it up on here for everyone to see it. Ugh. Watching those guys flying around the Ostkurve back then...just unreal.

marcush.
marcush.
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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yes indeed it was that early ..formula 2 was big in hockenheim those days ..remember formula 1 was coming to Hockenheim only after laudas crash in 1976 ..if I´m not mistaken i was watching in 1977/8/9 (I remember Lauda changing from Ferrari to Brabham and winning the processional gP .. and I remember Williams GP arriving at Hockenheim with just a 7.5 truck in Hockenheim and alan jones still mixing it with the front runners..amazing ).

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raymondu999
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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I actually prefer the "intermediate" layout of Hockenheim - the one after that oval-shaped beast, and the one before the current layout, still with the twinky little stadium section. I loved that back then - the cars would be sliding around quite a bit in there. Fantastic viewing.

I think Vettel will take this one. The Red Bull car is fantastic through slow corners, whereas the strength of the Ferrari lies in the high speed stuff and not slow corners. Vettel is also very good in Hockenheim.

In 2008 he outqualified Bourdais by half a second, and outqualified Mark and Coulthard on pace. Webber started 1 spot higher than Vettel, as Mark had qualified with a lighter fuel load in Q3, but even then Mark was only a few hundredths quicker. And this was BEFORE the updates that put the STR on par with the Red Bull. (that came 2 races later in Valencia). Oh, he finished ahead of the Bulls then, too :mrgreen:

2010 he held 6 tenths of an advantage to Mark in qualifying, before Mark couldn't touch him for the race. Mark tried pushing harder on his second Q3 run to match Vettel, but ran well wide at Turn 1 by overcooking the corner, losing 4 tenths in the process. Considering that the 2010 Red Bull was very good, but not the best, in slow corners, while the Ferraris were mechanical grip monsters with fantastic traction, braking and general slow corner pace Vettel still outqualified Fernando, by 0.002s. Alonso should've gotten pole, but for some weird reason started to diagonal the pit straight as he exited the last corner on his quali lap.

The surface is quite abrasive, but no real high energy corners. Methinks OOP like Hockenheim.
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Hail22
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Re: 2012 German Grand Prix - Hockenheim

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Qualifying:

1. Alonso
2. Schumacher
3. Webber
4. Grosjean
5. Vettel
6. Hamilton
7. Raikkonen
8. Massa
9. Rosberg
10. Perez

Race:

1. Alonso
2. Webber
3. Grosjean
4. Raikkonen
5. Vettel
6. Massa
7. Perez
8. Schumacher
9. Rosberg
10. Hamilton
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