Pirelli 2013

[Huntresa]

The way I see the tyre situation is that teams have to not be selfish and think about the fans. You pay hundreds of pounds to see the worlds fastest cars going all out and racing, not to watch cars save tyres. So if any teams block the move I think this is not for the good of the sport.

But at the same time the teams who wants to change the tyres are being selfish casue they only do it so they can become more competetive and not for the fans...

And who said we will get flat out racing with 2012 strcture and 2013 compounds? Kimi Raik and Lotus saved tyres all last year so

[VIZSLA]

The way I see the tyre situation is that teams have to not be selfish and think about the fans. You pay hundreds of pounds to see the worlds fastest cars going all out and racing, not to watch cars save tyres. So if any teams block the move I think this is not for the good of the sport.

So, you have an eye to visually discern when a car goes flat out or saves tyres?

You can't?

[lebesset]

the FIA step in to apply the rules !!!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107487


quite right too !

[turbof1]

Understandable.

So I guess we will have to wait for next year to have better tyres.

[Jonnycraig]

the FIA step in to apply the rules !!!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107487


quite right too !

With the kindest will in the world, the 'wrong' team has been winning for 3 years now. Time for 'the show' to get a change of scenery.

WDC & WCC tied up before the end of European season. No calls of 'boring' though because the winners will be in red, not blue.

[Nomore]

the FIA step in to apply the rules !!!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107487


quite right too !

Thanks for the article @lebesset. Great news hope FIA dont let this farce happens... [-o< ...They are still in time to save Formula 1.

Discussions between the FIA and Pirelli are ongoing regarding the tyre failures and making changes to prevent them happening again. These talks do not involve the subject of degradation or the number of pitstops

...eat this Bernie Ecclestone and Dietrich Mateschitz.

[Richard]

A change made to achieve a safer tyre could easily change the characteristics.

[VIZSLA]

A change made to achieve a safer tyre could easily change the characteristics.

Given the short time they have I'd be surprised if it doesn't.

[lebesset]

will be interesting to see what pirelli DO change ; the principal reason we didn't have the sort of delamination before they introduced this new belt was that the tyre deflated and the tread delaminated in a different way [ came off in chunks normally ]because the driver was forced to creep around the track or stop altogether

so perhaps the only solution is to return to less puncture resistant belts , back to quick deflations ; however that will change the stiffness of the tread area and hence the characteristics of the tyres , as noted ; in any case , will that be safer ? not in my view

what surprises me is that there has been nothing from the teams about vibrations caused by damage on the tread before delamination took place ..I know that alonso came in slightly early in the last race because of damage , but I thought there was a small loss of pressure in that case ; no wonder ferrari don't want tyre changes , if alonso had been on last years tyres he would not have won the race , may not even have finished

[FW17]

Until Pirelli came around I have never heard of driving to a delta time (could be wrong).

It's happened at every race for decades for fuel saving. Ever car will turn down the engine power during the race because the cars are under fuelled, in extreme cases the drivers are asked to short shift as well.

Fuel limits are in control of the team and anyway fuel saving are done for a section of a race and not the entire.

[godlameroso]

People think that because the drivers don't push 100% all the time that it's not real racing. It's a laughable proposition, clearly the drivers are racing, the thing is that it brings in more race craft. Drivers are still trying to eek every single ounce of performance of the cars, it's just that they're taking a long term approach instead of mindlessly going fast. Being mindlessly fast and having race craft and intelligence as well as speed is the difference between say Jarno Trulli and Fernando Alonso. Also Pirelli is just doing what is being asked of them, and it seems they went as aggressive as they could. However with limited testing, they had no idea how extreme the rubber was especially when the cars are at least a second faster than last year.

[FW17]

People think that because the drivers don't push 100% all the time that it's not real racing. It's a laughable proposition, clearly the drivers are racing, the thing is that it brings in more race craft. Drivers are still trying to eek every single ounce of performance of the cars, it's just that they're taking a long term approach instead of mindlessly going fast. Being mindlessly fast and having race craft and intelligence as well as speed is the difference between say Jarno Trulli and Fernando Alonso. Also Pirelli is just doing what is being asked of them, and it seems they went as aggressive as they could. However with limited testing, they had no idea how extreme the rubber was especially when the cars are at least a second faster than last year.

You can defend what is happening till the cows come home but the flaw as a whole is the competition is engineered modeled after the 2010 Montreal race. Limiting the cars from exploiting there potential so that it looks good for TV is not what F1 is about. Indy tried pack racing as it is great for TV, raced on a NASCAR track and ended up killing a driver. I am not saying FIA has gone that bonkers but still engineering competition for better TV drama is sports entertainment not sport, and pretty soon they will alienate the core motorsport fan base.

Pirelli had a earfull last season with many people questioning their ability to build a good racing tyre, still they go ahead and make this seasons tyres of weaker compounds. Paul Hembery is so desperate to keep himself in front of the camera that he does not care how it comes.

[turbof1]

The biggest flaw of all is actually they aren't simulating Canada 2010 at all. The many pitstops there were a consequence of cold weather conditions and a very green track. The tyres could not heat up properly and grained to oblivion. Drivers actually had to push very hard to get some heat into the tyres.

The tyres we have nowadays aren't graining; they simple degrade. The more you push, the hotter they get and the more they degrade. Instead of being "under the window", they are "above the window".

Tyre management has always been a part of racing, that is true. The question is: do we want that in F1? It isn't exciting to see drivers "coast and lift", not at all. If you want to have a better show, these things need to be taken into consideration. Nobody would have complained about Barcelona if things went like 2011: a 4 stop show where the top 5 actually pushed during each of their 5 stints. I rewatched that race; absolutely not a single complaint about tyres. The only one who was having problems with his tyres was Alonso during his last stint. People have been very eager to point out that the 2011 race also had 4 stops, telling everybody what a short memory the fans have. Well, the ones pointing at it apperently have the exact same problem.

[Richard]

People have been very eager to point out that the 2011 race also had 4 stops, telling everybody what a short memory the fans have. Well, the ones pointing at it apparently have the exact same problem.

I think that's slightly out of context. The refs to 2011 are in response to RB saying there were too many stops.

The behaviour of the tyres over those 5 stints is another matter altogether.

[FW17]

People have been very eager to point out that the 2011 race also had 4 stops, telling everybody what a short memory the fans have. Well, the ones pointing at it apparently have the exact same problem.

I think that's slightly out of context. The refs to 2011 are in response to RB saying there were too many stops.

The behaviour of the tyres over those 5 stints is another matter altogether.

No one patted Pirelli on their back after 2011 Spanish GP and asked them to repeat it in 2 years time. The issue with 2013 issue was that it was not a comfortable 4 stopper for all teams; Lotus comfy 3, Ferrari comfy 4 but remaining 3 probably needed 5 to be have been comfortable.