Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
wuzak
wuzak
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Mamba wrote:
23 Feb 2018, 20:35
Bit worried by the fact that Ferrari have not done a shakedown like nearly all the top teams or did they just run in secret around Fiorano? Anyone out there know anything?

MAMBA
Probably because there was decent amount of snow on the ground in Maranello.

Xwang
Xwang
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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I've seen a difference in how the airbox descend in the Ferrari compared to the McLaren.
In the McLaren it goes down a lot before so it perhaps creates less problems with the rear wing.
In that case, why the Ferrari airbox is made in that way?

dankane24
dankane24
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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George-Jung wrote:
22 Feb 2018, 17:34
dankane24 wrote:
22 Feb 2018, 16:43
Are the mirrors directing airflow down into the top sidepod intake?
Same thoughts here..
Seems to be verified by Scarbs now.
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https://drivetribe.com/gallery/dcX8CrEs ... ffEktqgs_A

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Vanja #66
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Here goes nothing! :)

Much like SF70-H, I'm stunned by its younger cousin. Like Seb and Scarbs already mentioned - every aspect of the car seems improved over the final 2017 design. And it seems the same goes with the overall concept - and for me, the concept is highly optimized downforce with high efficiency. With some very draggy details on the car, I can't really say it's a low-drag design, but it certainly seems to be so when comparing 71-H to 70-H.

Where Scarbs was slightly general with his analysis (he has a wider audience and is very good with bringing this tech stuff to them), I'd like to go a step further and mark some distinctive differences between these two cars. Before I go on, please note that not a single photo of the two in same views was taken at the same angle, so some size comparison is most likely inaccurate - but overall trends should be decently accurate.

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1) Y250 zone - a lot more slots than in latest spec FW in 2017, suggesting designers went in full attack mode here. This is one of few details I believe is draggier than last year. Do note that outboard from Y250 zone there is a flat, non-slotted area - that's were designers are making front end downforce. It's a continuous non-slotted surface very close to the ground, making a nice Venturi tunnel sucking the air from the front.

2) Camera pods seem a bit closer to the nose tip, even though they seem at the same height. Slotted connection to the nose was seen last year.

3) 3 smaller winglets replaced with a single larger one. This one is also more aggressive than last year, producing probably substantially more lift (percentage-wise). You can bet your life-savings this lift pays out massively overall.

4) Mirrors are a bit further back (and as low as final-spec in 2017), but overall about the same distance from top side pod inlet as last year. Unlike Scarbs, I'm not sure they are used to guide the air down (although that would be very very clever), as I'll explain and show further down this text.

5) Top side pod inlets are further back compared to cockpit cell, as is the leading edge of the side pod itself. It's a small trade-off for more "aerodynamically friendly" airflow. Also, top openings are just a bit bigger this year.

6) Tyre squirt slots seem nowhere here. They are actually obscured from view, but you'll see later that there are 4 of them again, even though last year there were 6. There's also some more details there, as you'll see.

7) Side pod contour seems more conventional. From this view, and some others as well, looks like radiators are also a bit further back as well. Most likely some packaging compromises were made for best overall design.

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8 ) Even though the team finished season 2017 with a completely different Y250 zone and leading edge, here we can see they are back to their first concept. Instead of a slight rise of leading edge, they went for drop and then flat.

9) Also note the difference in outboard area, where arches are more inward, just like they were on final 2017 FW. Of the Top 3 teams, Ferrari has the most developed FW compared to final 2017 design.

10) A big difference in brake duct size, and an introduction to hybrid ducting design. We've seen some teams avoid big front brake ducts to reduce drag and use this clean air further rearward (Mercedes, most notably), but Ferrari haven't done so in a few years. Without any doubt, this is a drag reduction.

11) This detail shows even better how bigger and more aggressive this downward winglet is.

12) The biggest visual change between 2017 and 2018 cars. Looking at it from this perspective, one has to think about last year's design as conservative in terms of overall side pod inlet size. A big reduction in frontal opening, and a small increase in top opening. This was very different last year, with frontal inlet being almost the same size as on other cars. At the time, it seemed like there was a small mass flow of air coming from top inlet. Now, it seems two inlets introduce about the same mass flow, or very similar. This makes it much easier to configure and design the radiator intake itself, although my experience in this area is very modest. :)

Seeing a number of 2018 cars for prior to Ferrari sporting this type of solution, it was clear all of them have reduced frontal inlet surface compared to SF70-H. As Steven suggested somewhere, this could have something to do with rules for 2018 allegedly imposing a bottom limit of air temperature in engine plenum to 10 degrees C above ambient temperature. If teams have managed to bring these lower than that before, they could be using smaller intercoolers now - explaining significantly smaller side pod inlets on every car.

Again, without any doubt, this reduces the drag significantly, while also enabling even more (high energy) air to go to the back of the car. As for the mid wing, it is positioned at a lot smaller angle compared to last year, also reducing the drag. I have my doubts if it is actually used to create some downforce, or if it's only used for airflow control, but either way - drag is reduced.

13) Different position of mirrors, very similar to final spec in 2017. More on them later down, there's a better picture to explain my thoughts.

13.5) I managed to miss to mark the difference in airbox design (that's how used to it I already am and that's what Halo does to us poor technical analysis junkies). There was a change in this area during last season, there were "ears" added to the airbox, so this is not a big change. Other than that, this seems to be a favorable design with obligatory Halo in front of it.

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On this picture you can see that inside surface of mirrors seems symmetrical. This would indicate only drag reduction for mirrors, in ways discussed on this thread. I honestly don't see it as an attempt to guide the air down towards the top side pod inlet, no matter how cool that would be. I'd like to see it happen, I just don't see it now.

26) Please excuse obvious flaw with numeration. #-o This small detail shows a flap helping guide the air from Halo down to top inlet. It's details like this I absolutely love about F1 and why I give myself time to spot as much of them as possible.

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14) Barge boards have seen further evolution from last year, with a number of nice little details added. You can barely see it here, but you will bellow - there is a separate frontal element, just like on final spec last year. Better control of airflow, some vortex induction (could be to enhance Y250 vortex itself). A bit of muscle-flexing from Ferrari, showing all this on launch-spec car.

15) Second biggest visual change on the car from last year is this side pod deflector. Very similar to what Red Bull introduced last year, a hybrid solution between Ferrari and Mercedes. Interesting to see that both teams ended up with similar launch-spec solutions this year, with an L piece that is used for flow control in both directions. The obvious difference is the number of slots on Red Bull and Ferrari.

On one side, slots provide energy to outside airflow, but with a small drag penalty from slots and stronger vortices. If Ferrari have managed to keep the airflow attached all the way on the outside of the deflector, great for them. Will be interesting to see where they take the development in this area, my guess is they introduce more slots some time in this season, like Red Bull and Mercedes. Also note, unlike last year, this whole area is under a single surface, merging the sidepod with deflector. This has reduced number of vortices from 5 to just 2. That's right, vortex-induced-drag reduction. :)

16) A small change in engine cover design for this season, with a longer airbox now. The team kept their elegant "chicane" line of engine cover, which is what Mercedes uses now as well. Both with airbox and side pods, it seems like Ferrari chose to clear the rear of the car as much as possible and push the components under the sking more forward, centralizing the mass as well. We've seen teams make these sort of changes from season to season. I don't think any solution is right or wrong as such, it's simply a matter of overall design philosophy for a certain car.

Note that on this picture, we can see that the car is definitely longer this year, but I'm not sure these pictures should be used for outright comparison, there's too much difference in lenses used. Also, compared to cockpit cell, it seems car is stretched both forward and rearward. This difference in lenses by no means accidental, Ferrari are doing their best to hide some of the features of the car, just like they used a central reflector to put a big shade bellow the side pod on last year's studio pictures.

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On this picture you can see some of the details Ferrari obscured on studio photos, a number of new Mercedes-like wiglets are introduced on the outside of designated barge board area. Barge board development step from 2017 to 2018 Ferrari seems on par with the step Red Bull took with RB14 compared to final spec RB13 at the top of the class.

I tried, and failed horribly, to illustrate vortices induced in this area now on 2018 Ferrari. Their numbers are fewer than last year without any doubt, if we don't count the ones on newly introduced winglets. Those are most likely very weak and are probably feeding the Y250 vortex. Same direction of rotation of vortices is shown in same colour.

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17) A nice change of rather simple FW pillars to a McLaren-esque design. To be honest, it seemed to fit overall 2017 Ferrari concept and I was surprised not to see this during last season. Overall, the nose and Y250 zone are very similar to McLaren MCL32/33, meaning they work very well together.

18 ) Just a simple demonstration of FW development over a single year. Even though this type of front wings is 10 years "old" teams are still making big steps from year to year. Note also how much more aggressive the outwash arches are right now.

19) Turning vanes design is going towards Red-Bull-like tunnel design. This provides a nice separation of the airflow going under the nose and air going trough front suspension (which is under heavy influence of Y250 vortex). Unlike Red Bull, Ferrari are using a very, very wide tunnel going outboard from under the nose.

20/21) Apologies for numeration error here. A small change in floor leading edge this season, with added vortex generators, for added suction and flow stability in yaw and dirty air. No, there is no hole in this zone, please look again the first picture of this post and you'll see a legality slot between barge board area and side pods. This is obviously the same for floor leading edge. Like I said before, if rules allowed for multiple closed cross sections in this area, teams would use this to introduce slats to the floor, a much better and purposeful solution compared to vortex generators. Needless to say, these two solutions are mutually exclusive - if you use slats there wont be any vortices from your vortex generators.

22) As you can see on the picture in picture here, the under cut is a bit bigger this year. Also visible is the change in side pod contour. Again, I can't put my finger on it, I believe these are simply different solutions to somewhat different philosophies.

23) T-wing is where it can be this year, a lot lower due to rule change. Honestly, it was a stupid rule change. With this new position, I believe the role of T-wing also changes. Other than adding a bit of downforce, it could now be a kind of slat for rear wing. In central zone definitely, outboard doesn't look like it. Tip vortices probably aren't strong, but I think this particular T-wing has an airfoil twist span-wise. Tip looks to be under bigger angle of attack than the root. This could induce stronger vortices, helping with keeping the airflow attached on aggressive rear wing angles. I'm waiting for this theory to go on a one-way trip to trash bin the moment we see joined biplane design like last year. :D

24) Just a small detail to compare rear suspension with the one seen on Sauber (looking identical, as expected), as we haven't had an opportunity to look at this car from behind.

25) Here we can see tyre squirt slots, in spite of Ferrari's efforts to hide them. On the trialing edge right in front of rear tyre, you can also see a small wing-like shape. These are some very very nice details for launch-spec car.

Well, I think it's time to wrap this analysis up. Overall, Ferrari seem to have changed their aero strategy from outright downforce in spite of drag to a more aero efficient design. We've seen them struggle to keep up with Mercedes in high speed corners, even though they were kings in slow speed corners. A number of experts have attributed this difference to Mercedes highly efficient aero design. Ferrari seem to have done everything they can to minimize the drag of this new car, while increasing the wheelbase to add some raw, delicious, high-efficiency downforce.

All in all, hat's off to the red team!
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

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#BlessYouLaddie

Kalsi
Kalsi
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Did someone miss this? Can't remember seeing this on any car.

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Sevach
Sevach
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Ferrari went back and forth on the slotted base element topic last year, but it was always a full length slot, never like this.

Maybe this combines the best of both worlds.

sarjen
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Joined: 24 Feb 2018, 01:50

Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Front and rear wing were subject to change during the testing. I'm sure about that.
Why didn't the team develop a new front suspension during the winter? They are behind in that area compare with Mercedes.

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ScrewCaptain27
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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sarjen wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 04:43
Front and rear wing were subject to change during the testing. I'm sure about that.
Why didn't the team develop a new front suspension during the winter? They are behind in that area compare with Mercedes.
Well it obviously does not fit their design philosophy, which is extremely different to Mercedes.
"Stupid people do stupid things. Smart people outsmart each other, then themselves."
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Just_a_fan
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Vanja #66 wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 01:13


1) Y250 zone - a lot more slots than in latest spec FW in 2017, suggesting designers went in full attack mode here. This is one of few details I believe is draggier than last year. Do note that outboard from Y250 zone there is a flat, non-slotted area - that's were designers are making front end downforce. It's a continuous non-slotted surface very close to the ground, making a nice Venturi tunnel sucking the air from the front.
The slot is there for one reason - to keep the flow attached on the underside. That's also why there is a slot in the lower flap element here too. This suggests that they are working the Y250 area harder and this is confirmed by the larger area of flap in this area too.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

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Mr. Fahrenheit
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Vanja #66 wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 01:13
Beautiful work, Vanja! Really appreciate the time and effort that goes in to producing a post of this calibre, THANK YOU!

=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Vanja great analysis!

My two cents now. The mirrors remind of of the audi R18 philosophy : reducing drag and vorticitity by flowing air through the car not around it. So i agree with that part of your analysis and not convinced by Scarb's theory that the mirrors direct air downward.
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JPBD1990
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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https://instagram.com/p/Bfjm43LhwGz/

Compared to the merc, do we think centre of gravity is a problem for Ferrari? It is generally a much taller and slimmer philosophy, where the merc is very low and chubby. Thoughts?

Xwang
Xwang
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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Those photos have completely different point of views (they have aligned front wing and the top of front wheels and so Ferrari front wheel is smaller in height than Mercedes one) so no comparison can be made IMHO.

dankane24
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
24 Feb 2018, 14:28
Vanja great analysis!

My two cents now. The mirrors remind of of the audi R18 philosophy : reducing drag and vorticitity by flowing air through the car not around it. So i agree with that part of your analysis and not convinced by Scarb's theory that the mirrors direct air downward.
If the mirrors aren't being used to direct airflow into the top sidepod intake than can someone explain why they would have a downward swooping trailing edge to them?
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Sevach
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Re: Scuderia Ferrari SF71H

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