2021 Dutch Grand Prix - Zandvoort Sept 3 - 5

[NathanOlder]

Starting on the C1 hard tires >>> SC >>> everyone is into the pit >>> stay out and he will be in the front.

It still doesn't work. If the field are pitting, then it won't be in the first 5-10 laps, as all the medium runners will stay out anyway. After 5 laps anyway the leaders will be 5 seconds ahead of 4th and each car around 1 seconds spread after that. If the SC comes out then, the leaders will be able to pit and come out and only lose 10-15 seconds maximum with safety car speeds.

So Perez does not get involved unless its a blue flag moment.

Sorry, I should have posted a and not a . It was a joke.

Yeah that would have helped.

[maxxer]

What about the last minute chassis handicap that Merc got?

That was not deliberate by the FIA. Most pundits though the rule change would hurt high rake teams more.

I'm certainly glad it helped Red Bull though, RBR need all the help they can get!

So you suppose Newey is overrated, and the Mercedes design team is far more skilled with their low rake car? It's not to do with Mercedes historically throwing more money at the problem than everyone else on the chassis (even more than Red Bull or Ferrari)?

Mercedes also threw more money at the power unit side than anyone else too for that matter...

For once, lets assume Merc was throwing more money, but who stopped other teams doing the same (as per you, rules are same for everyone.. right)? I would prefer not to comment on Newey, but it is not like he has won everything every time (and history has enough evidence of the same).

Reminds me of when Schumi went to ferrari , ferrari was absolute rubbish the years before with failures on last lap and such. Suddenly Schumi signed and they threw loads of money against it, but it wasnt sustainable there was even rumours then they had to sell artwork from the office to get income. But they did have a few great years which put the brand back into F1

[renault rs26]

Great Qualy session!

Anyone else literally have their heart in their mouth when we went onboard for T3?

2 Mercs vs Max is gonna be tricky for RB, even more so on a track where you can't overtake.

Mercs are usually ridiculous on tyre deg. I expect Max to pit and Lewis to go long with a Bottas roadblock at some point.

Can be bet on which drivers are gonna cause a red flag?

Mazepin, Tsunoda...


Be interesting to see Perez's strategy tomorrow!

Mazepin caused less incidents/red flags in races this season than Bottas...

[markoc]

Never is it worth 2 tenths. Its 1 tenth at the most.

If you watch the lap comparison between Lewis and Max, if its correct, Lewis was a fraction over 1 tenth behind at the DRS line. at the finish line, the gap was 0.038. So it was less than 1 tenth.

Its only about 200m from the DRS line to the finish line. Nothing like a full DRS zone. It would have been much more costly if this happened at the start of his lap.

You're speculating as much as anyone else. The comparison chart in the middle is made trough the mini-sector times. And that last mini-sector, where Hamilton gained, doesn't necessarily have to begin exactly where the DRS begins, so you can't use that to figure out the exact deficit of the DRS not opening.

But I can tell you in 200m DRS isn't worth 2 tenths. Otherwise it eould be worth over 1 seconds in the whole lap, and thats certainly not the case.

Also when you watch the onboard, At the DRS line Max was 1-2 car lengths ahead. By the line it was pretty much dead level.

2 car lengths is surely not 2 tenths?

I remember that Bottas gained on Max in final sector something like 0.19. That is why I said two tenths. It wasn't accurate calculation or something I wanted to cause a debate now. It was just new to me that he didn't have DRS in his final run, and I just wanted to point it out. If this cost him 1 or 2 tenths or 0.5 tenth we can't calculate correctly anyway so it's irrelevant.

[maxxer]

Oh my you dont want to piss off this team mate lol

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/maze ... e/6660459/

[renault rs26]

If only we could have Lewis and Max in the same car for a season so that all these "expert" discussions on who is extracting more from the car could end. The truth is we might never know for sure. Trying to compare Lewis vs Max by comparing them against other drivers just leads nowhere. By that logic, Lando is much faster than Max because he is beating Ricciardo with a much bigger margin than Max did in their last year together. He was also not as dominant against Sainz in their 2015/2016 seasons certainly not more that Leclerc is now. It is all speculation, we are watching a team sport where the besta combination of car/driver is going to have the best chance of winning. Nothing more than that.

Lando knows how to drive his McLaren better than Danny does. However, if it so happens that Danny cannot drive a certain style of car, i would say Norris is all round better racer and probably more talented, but I wouldn't say Norris is quicker. If they both can somehow tune their cars exactly how they want then that is where you decide who is quicker.

As for Max, we will never know how he performs against peak Lewis even in the same car because let's face it, Lewis is 36 years old.

As a fan of the sport, I have no desire to see who is "better" because they are from different eras and Lewis has nothing to prove really. He already did his work and achieved his dreams when Max was still playing with powe rangers.

It would be unfair for Lewis to now put them in the same cars, and it would also do disservice to Max.

Max's real rivals are Lando, Charles, Carlos, Russell, Ocon and Stroll.

Carlos, Russell - I read Carlos Reutemann, wtf

[El Scorchio]

Great Qualy session!

Anyone else literally have their heart in their mouth when we went onboard for T3?

2 Mercs vs Max is gonna be tricky for RB, even more so on a track where you can't overtake.

Mercs are usually ridiculous on tyre deg. I expect Max to pit and Lewis to go long with a Bottas roadblock at some point.

Can be bet on which drivers are gonna cause a red flag?

Mazepin, Tsunoda...


Be interesting to see Perez's strategy tomorrow!

Perez could have been so useful for Red Bull with his ability to go long. They will probably be relying on either Gasly or one of the Ferraris to jump Bottas at the start.

So everyone is OK with Horner appearing to operate a 4 car team? Imagine if Merc were in a similar situation and Toto was referring to Lando in the similar way Horner is Gasly. “It’s OK Bottas is starting at the back but we have Lando in the mix”. It’d break the internet…

Just a thought.

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

[BlueCheetah66]

Perez could have been so useful for Red Bull with his ability to go long. They will probably be relying on either Gasly or one of the Ferraris to jump Bottas at the start.

So everyone is OK with Horner appearing to operate a 4 car team? Imagine if Merc were in a similar situation and Toto was referring to Lando in the similar way Horner is Gasly. “It’s OK Bottas is starting at the back but we have Lando in the mix”. It’d break the internet…

Just a thought.

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

[maxxer]

So everyone is OK with Horner appearing to operate a 4 car team? Imagine if Merc were in a similar situation and Toto was referring to Lando in the similar way Horner is Gasly. “It’s OK Bottas is starting at the back but we have Lando in the mix”. It’d break the internet…

Just a thought.

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

Perez being so out of position in that car will enjoy watching him today

[Manoah2u]

i would be seriously impressed if everybody wore yellow clogs

[renault rs26]

Since Perez is starting from pitlane maybe he can avoid chaos at the start. And maybe Alonso can block Hamilton long enough to help out Max

Starting on the C1 hard tires >>> SC >>> everyone is into the pit >>> stay out and he will be in the front.

It's gonna be Red/VC/SC gallore I reckon. If not for the first lap(s) mayhem I wouldn't be surprised if fatigue kicks in throughout the field ..

Remember Baku 2016, everyone thought it will be chaotic and we had procession.

[RZS10]

So everyone is OK with Horner appearing to operate a 4 car team? Imagine if Merc were in a similar situation and Toto was referring to Lando in the similar way Horner is Gasly. “It’s OK Bottas is starting at the back but we have Lando in the mix”. It’d break the internet…

Just a thought.

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

It's not that hard to stick to facts (especially on a technical forum) ya know?
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=29890&p=987428#p987428

Laps 47&48 car 11 was in P10.

[El Scorchio]

So everyone is OK with Horner appearing to operate a 4 car team? Imagine if Merc were in a similar situation and Toto was referring to Lando in the similar way Horner is Gasly. “It’s OK Bottas is starting at the back but we have Lando in the mix”. It’d break the internet…

Just a thought.

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

You might want to check that claim.

[renault rs26]

Well, it’s the same with team orders isn’t it. Everyone goes nuts about it if Bottas does anything which helps out Hamilton, but at Silverstone RBR literally took WDC points from Perez and WCC points from themselves just to deny Hamilton fastest lap and gaining an extra point on Verstappen and ne’er a whisper from the people who are usually so disapproving of these things….

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

You might want to check that claim.

If Perez was 10th then RB didn't lose point in WCC (RB lost 1 Mercedes lost 1) but gained one point in WDC.

[El Scorchio]

Perez wasn't in the points when they pitted him

You might want to check that claim.

If Perez was 10th then RB didn't lose point in WCC (RB lost 1 Mercedes lost 1) but gained one point in WDC.

Red Bull didn’t gain anything. They lost a WDC point and a WCC point. Perez didn’t score the fastest lap point because they took him out of 10th and put him back in 15th where it doesn’t count. All they did was take away the fastest lap point from Hamilton to benefit Verstappen purposely at the detriment of Perez and their own WCC score.