2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix - Yas Marina, Dec 10 - 12

[PlatinumZealot]

I think only die-hard fans of Hamilton, like yourself, will see this title as tainted. Just like some people have conspiracy theories about Glock and Interlagos in 2008. Or Vettel in 2010 on the last GP. For die-hard fans of 1 driver it is never understandable. For 90-95% of the people there is no difference.

What was the purpose of the last race then? Is it not a part of the championship? The two drivers were equal on points, and the race was billed as the ultimate showdown between the two drivers. It ended up being a damp squib after the first two squabbles, almost as boring as a Mayweather boxing match... but that was the race! Why did Masi feel he had to put his thumb on the scales to manipulate the result, the world will never know.

[JordanMugen]

Even if Mercedes wins the legal battle and FIA has to admit that the SC procedure was not within the regulations, I don't think this will change the outcome of the DWC, because what is supposed to happen?

Exactly. Nothing can happen. The race results as per the timing on the day stand no matter what. It's not like the chequered flag was shown a lap early or anything. From a timekeeping perspective, the race times of the competitors from lights out to chequered flag were correct and stand unchallenged.

Make Masi spend a few days sweating and worrying about whether he's going to have to face further appearances before a "court" (whichever one it goes to) over the winter break.

Masi did nothing wrong, he was just wanting to get the race going without lapped cars in the way. Wolff should apologise for rudely saying "Sorry?" in a snarky tone in response to Masi's perfectly polite statement "it's called a motor race" on the radio channel.

[JordanMugen]

Sport sometimes means that the guy you dont like wins. Sometimes, even the one who didnt deserve wins. But the inportant thing is, that it was done within the rules. If you take that away, it’s meaningless and hollow.

Incorrect penalties are given in Association Football or other sports all the time. It is extremely common.

I don't get this ignore it and move on, why should people move on. It was an illegal action and Merc either need to take it further

It makes them look like bad sports. Why are Mercedes GP so fussed?!

I'm sure your favourite football team in any type of football or cricket or basketball or field hockey team has lost due to an incorrect or contentious referee's or umpire's decision near the end of a close match. Oh well, these things happen. Nevermind, it's no bother.

[langedweil]

...

Doesnt change the fact that max got gifted from the race director himself by manipulation.
These are facts.
No rules were twisted for any incident involving Lewis and him benefiting this year.

Max even had 2 incidences that were punishable by black flag and race ban and masi turned a blind eye. Brasil and Saudi.

So it goes back to what i was saying. Max only drove to 8 wins this year. Lewis raced to 9.

You're quite exhausting mate, and you just keep going down the same rabbithole over and over again mixing up opinions with facts, just as they suit.
Look, your frustration is real and fully understandable, and I guess most ppl didn't want to end things this way (including myself), but if that Latifi crash was one lap earlier or if the backmarkers were shiftly and well in time removed from in between just to have one green lap, you'd be frustrated exactly the same (but you will deny that ofcourse). At the base it was a strategy call (staying out on 40 laps hards, logically because of track position) that didn't work out, whilst maybe gambling on ending behind the SC. That call was made unbeknownst of the speed of cleaning up the rubble, and that's where MB lost their upper hand of the otherwise totally controlled race. Just like Max was served at Baku, Silverstone, Hungary, and well maybe even Imola.
It was always gonna be a shitty outcome, a writing on the wall for that matter.

I'm not a driver guy, so honest to God I couldn't really care less about WDC/WCC, but I really enjoyed this years though racing from these 2 absolute gladiators in their own league, and not knowing any raceresult beforehand. I just hope for about 8+ different winners next year and even more tense fights ontrack.

[JordanMugen]

I just hope for about 8+ different winners next year and even more tense fights ontrack.

Hopefully McLaren, Ferrari and maybe Alpine and more will be regularly in the mix for victories in the 2022 season.

[langedweil]

Dumbest tweet of the last 36hrs ..

[diffuser]

This was a decision that favored a certain outcome.

So what? I don't have a problem with the outcome, and if Mercedes-Benz are good sports who "welcome competition" they shouldn't be fussed either.

You know. I don't even think it was gifted to Max as much as it was taken away from Lewis.

The best driver won:

Max 10 wins
Lewis 8 wins

But Spa, if Monza? I don't care.

It seems bias precludes some from being able to appreciate a Race Director merely getting lapped cars out of the way to the best of their ability. Both drivers had good fortune (e.g., Hamilton crashed at Imola and still scored 2nd place) and bad fortune (Hamilton locked up from the lead at Baku, throwing away an easy win, after Verstappen had a tyre failure). Sometimes one benefitted from safety cars and red flags, and sometimes the other did. It mostly evens out and is all part of motor racing.

Then there are reactionary calls to eliminate bunching under the safety car, eliminate lapped cars getting laps back, and convert red flagged races to aggregate time to optimise "fairness", yet the same posters didn't find this a priority just one Grand Prix beforehand!

As for the stats. 10 wins is more like 8. Spa was not driven and was gifted. And abudhabi was also gifted. These 2 had nothing to do with luck. Just pure regulator interference.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

Hamilton did more amazing things in his car this year and i think reminded most fans that his racing tool set is more complete.

This is bias in the extreme. Apparently Verstappen dancing the car between the walls at Monaco to a dominant win is without talent, while Hamilton who has heavily outqualified by Bottas and then stuck behind Aston Martins & Alpha Tauris around Monte Carlo apparently showed more skill?

We can list them, but he hasnt really driven any amazing races. I think he performed as expected

Mercurial wins by Verstappen at circuits like Zandvoort are apparently discarded?!

Think you missed the whole point. Nobody thinks Max isn't a good driver. Just Max and his car haven't been as fast as Lewis and his car this year Especially over the last 8 races where
Hamilton has won 5 of those. While Max has won just 2.

Masi did something no racing director have ever done.

[ambientnoiz]

Masi was waiting for the moment when he was allowed to use his overriding powers to set the outcome of the race. 48.12 isnt a rule. It’s only a default standard operating procedure guideline. He has complete plausible deniability because 15.3e allows him to go god mode and do whatever the f* he wants, which he did. They need to remove that, because it makes this whole sport a sham. Already setting bs precedents arbitrarily all season long, he’s either a puppet or corrupt or a combination of both with a pinch of incompetence. Imagine this happened to Max next year, and Masi decides to award the WDC to another driver just because he may think it would be nice for every driver to get a taste at least once, now that he’s in charge. Is that what we could be looking forward to from here on?

[Schuttelberg]

Discussions on forums is getting unbelievably tiresome and social media like twitter etc is just a joke.

Max deserved this championship in my eyes. He drove the socks off the red bull this year and I have no doubt in my mind that he would have won the title in the Mercedes as well.

But what happened in the last five laps was a petulant joke. That was not sport. The incident on lap 1 was poor because Lewis should not have been allowed to be ahead. "Lasting advantage" is relative. Putting 5 seconds on Max in a faster car is something pretty much 20 other drivers could do but passing him on track is a whole new world. Lewis would have got him at the stops anyway.

However, what happened in the last 5 laps is very very close to race/championship fixing. Just for the way Lewis handled himself, deserves a huge huge amount of respect. I urge fans on both sides to stop squabbling and see the good side of the side you're not on.

One thing I will say is that while what happened in the end is very bad for me as a purist and someone who has watched for close to 30 years now, it was pure euphoria seeing Mr.Wolff be humiliated on world television. I have been saying for a long long time that he simply ended up in the right place at the right time and Lewis saved him from major embarrassment of himself in the 2018 fight with Ferrari but his true personality is well and truly out now and it's not pretty.

[dans79]

I urge fans on both sides to stop squabbling and see the good side of the side you're not on.

Yea, no respect when you follow up the above with the below!

it was pure euphoria seeing Mr.Wolff be humiliated on world television.

[dans79]

It makes them look like bad sports. Why are Mercedes GP so fussed?!

I'm sure your favourite football team in any type of football or cricket or basketball or field hockey team has lost due to an incorrect or contentious referee's or umpire's decision near the end of a close match. Oh well, these things happen. Nevermind, it's no bother.

Because not everyone lives by the o well shucks mindset, that's what losers do. On the other side of the spectrum, are the people who will make it their mission in life to destroy those who they believe have wronged them rightly or wrongly!

[dans79]

It makes them look like bad sports. Why are Mercedes GP so fussed?!

I'm sure your favourite football team in any type of football or cricket or basketball or field hockey team has lost due to an incorrect or contentious referee's or umpire's decision near the end of a close match. Oh well, these things happen. Nevermind, it's no bother.

Because not everyone lives by the o well shucks mindset, that's what losers do. On the other side of the spectrum, are the people who will make it their missing in life to destroy those who the belive have wronged them rightly or wrongly!

As an aside, did Trump ever accept the election defeat?

...

[DChemTech]

This was a decision that favored a certain outcome.

So what? I don't have a problem with the outcome, and if Mercedes-Benz are good sports who "welcome competition" they shouldn't be fussed either.

You know. I don't even think it was gifted to Max as much as it was taken away from Lewis.

The best driver won:

Max 10 wins
Lewis 8 wins

But Spa, if Monza? I don't care.

It seems bias precludes some from being able to appreciate a Race Director merely getting lapped cars out of the way to the best of their ability. Both drivers had good fortune (e.g., Hamilton crashed at Imola and still scored 2nd place) and bad fortune (Hamilton locked up from the lead at Baku, throwing away an easy win, after Verstappen had a tyre failure). Sometimes one benefitted from safety cars and red flags, and sometimes the other did. It mostly evens out and is all part of motor racing.

Then there are reactionary calls to eliminate bunching under the safety car, eliminate lapped cars getting laps back, and convert red flagged races to aggregate time to optimise "fairness", yet the same posters didn't find this a priority just one Grand Prix beforehand!

As for the stats. 10 wins is more like 8. Spa was not driven and was gifted. And abudhabi was also gifted. These 2 had nothing to do with luck. Just pure regulator interference.

They will race again. But i suspect Something has to work out in the courts for Hamilton and the team for being robbed.

Hamilton did more amazing things in his car this year and i think reminded most fans that his racing tool set is more complete.

This is bias in the extreme. Apparently Verstappen dancing the car between the walls at Monaco to a dominant win is without talent, while Hamilton who has heavily outqualified by Bottas and then stuck behind Aston Martins & Alpha Tauris around Monte Carlo apparently showed more skill?

We can list them, but he hasnt really driven any amazing races. I think he performed as expected

Mercurial wins by Verstappen at circuits like Zandvoort are apparently discarded?!

Think you missed the whole point. Nobody thinks Max isn't a good driver. Just Max and his car haven't been as fast as Lewis and his car this year Especially over the last 8 races where
Hamilton has won 5 of those. While Max has won just 2.

Masi did something no racing director have ever done.

The championship is decided over the whole season, not on who has the most wins in the last 8 races.

[dans79]

The championship is decided over the whole season, not on who has the most wins in the last 8 races.

Funny you should mention that, because people got points this year for a farce of a race that never actually happened. All thanks to the same man, who made the last race of the season a complete joke!

[DChemTech]

I'm just going to post this here, so we can all keep things in perspective.
https://cdn.cleverism.com/wp-content/u ... 308500.png

Why be in denial when the race control actually ignore their own written rules.

I don't get this ignore it and move on, why should people move on. It was an illegal action and Merc either need to take it further or FIA need to make a statement explaining the illegal actions of their employee.

If you are mugged and robbed, do you just shrug your shoulders and move on, or do you contact the police?

You keep omitting the fact that a season is more than a single race. Lewis deserved to win this race, yes. But over the whole season there have been more disputable decisions that affected the outcome, the championship is not handed by a single event. If you are bothered by the impact of stewarding misjudgements, the only fair and unbiased option would be to review every single race, every single rulechange, by a wide team of experts, quantify the impact on scoring (as far as that is possible) and hand out the title on a rewritten scorechart. Does that seem satisfactory? The other option is to accept that in referee sports mistakes are made. Sometimes big ones and particulary sour ones, but they happen - some in your favour, others not. But yes, you will have to move on. Just investigating and 'correcting' one incident in favor of one team while leaving others unchanged is possibly more biased than not investigating any - because at that point you show you are willing to revert decisions in favor of one team but not for others. The unbiased options are accepting mistakes happen and that they can hit any team, or reviewing the entire season, which is unworkable.